Gypsy crime doesn't exist, it would be racist discrimination to recognize the obvious pattern, so we'll just do the PC thing and ignore it. Cool.
Let's call this insane court decision the suicide note of a nation.

Like stan said,we are told there is no "Gypsy crime" yet we see evidence all around,its okay if they are throwing grenades at each other or shooting through windows at each other (these were quickly blamed,incorrectly on the right wing )but now whites feel insecure in their own villages and can not rely on a Police presence locally.
This case is not over by a long way--believe me.

@Stan, Ricsi, Hotpaprika (you're bound to jump in on this one)...: Hungary has a police force, a court system and a parliament. These are the instruments through which we govern over selves, not by having others decide that they know better than us. The basic principles of a democracy is missing from these organisation which is best explained through the words of Tony Benn, a British socialist MP: 'If one meets a powerful person--Adolf Hitler, Joe Stalin or Bill Gates--ask them five questions: "What power have you got? Where did you get it from? In whose interests do you exercise it? To whom are you accountable? And how can we get rid of you?" If you cannot get rid of the people who govern you, you do not live in a democratic system.' Speech to the House of Commons (22 March 2001) (Hansard, c. 510).

This country has elections through which you decide who and how you are to be governed. Your collective idea of self-government is just dictatorship by stealth.

Do we have to stress the word "Gypsy". We should be concentrating on eliminating crime in general. I'd hate to live in a country where "Hungarian crime" is OK, but "Gypsy crime" is not.

Our police force are corrupt, our military is defunct, we have no protection from within or outside our nation, the Majority of Hungarians are controlled by the minority. The reason the national guarda was formed was to protect and encourage Hungarians for hope. National guard is a legal body protecting and working towards a better Hungary.

@Hotpaprika: Your whingeing is the 'tyranny of the majority' argument, used throughout the centuries by dictators and tyrants to legitimise undemocratic actions. Also, "..is a legal body.." seems rather hopeful under the circumstances. Why not do the decent thing and invest in democracy. It's harder work than marching up and down in a uniform pretending to be helpful, but the end result is longer lasting. Looking at the people in the garda, why would anyone ask their help? They either old/fat men that have lost their place in doing anything useful with their lives long ago or old women.

@Hotpaprika: What have you learnt from history? Making the same mistake over and over again is not the way to go.
Remember: The first time is a learning experience.

@Van , your a Dickhead!

It's a good move although the justification seems a little marginal. If Hungary had have an appropriate legal frame to penalize promoting of extremism, such bypasses would not have been necessary. Anyway it's a step in good direction, those mistaken hungarian clowns marching in uniforms should have been prosecuted a long time ago.

@Hotpaprika: "Van , your a Dickhead!" That's more like it, cogent and sustained discourse, the bread and butter of democracy. Good to see you're coming round.

Vandorlo,

You should visit Hungary when you're wandering in the neighborhood. Ask your "5 questions" when you meet Gyurcsany, see if you can get an honest answer out of him. The Hungarian government, police or justice system are not in the business to protect people, and self defense is apparently prohibited. Nor because anyone really care about gypsies, it's the ruling class and special interest groups who are afraid, very afraid as they should be. That's why any attempt to unite Hungarians is immediately labeled as "extremist". There's no real freedom or democracy here, not even close. On one side people lost faith and pretty much gave up on trying to influence decisions, on the other side the "elite" is getting comfortable with navigating a divided country into moral and financial bankruptcy while living the good life. There's no responsibility, no accountability, corruption is wide-spread and in most cases goes unpunished, even when we find out about them. The real problem in this country is not the Garda, it's the other side, clueless liberals supporting an illegitimate government.

What democracy, it's an illusion! VAN its all bullshit!!

I agree with hotpaprika but it's the best we got.

Stan,

You call that freedom??

Freedom would be if a Roma or a Jew would be welcome into the Magyar Garda. that would be freedom. What else do you want? ohhhh. I got, you want dictatorship. As long as it is in line with what you agree (and I see is not that hard do brainwash you). Let's just imagine you do not agree with some point in this world you are facing. For sample (OMG!!!) you turn out to be gay.... Can you imagine?? Good no?

Good luck with your life man, live the others in peace.

Hey Reni,

You know what? I think you might be right. All this hate is unuseful. From now on, instead of spding so much energy with this bad guys I will try to be a good fellow Christian and help people around me with what they really need. This world will be a better place and politics will have nothing to do with that. wil help even Roma, jews and black people instead of finding away to exterminate them.

Thank you Jesus for your words.

Reni
I hate to shatter your ego,but the Gárda is open to any Magyar patriot,there was a Jew who was happy to join and he was interviewed by the press--look it up,I can not be bothered to provide the source,but it was on the Jobbik main site. Gypsy members,No,but only because it means a VOLUNTARY commitment to working and supporting your country,no freebies with the Gárda . Maybe I am cynical but could that be part of the explanation ??????
Gypsies who work and contribute to society are as good as the next man,but I think that only accounts for 5% of them--there is the real problem.

@Stan: 'Ask your "5 questions" when you meet Gyurcsany...' Are you serious? Why do you keep pretending this is a dictatorship. You might not like the PM, but he was elected fair and square, first by his party, later by the country. Within the constitutional powers that exist there is no way to remove a leader or party that mislead the country in order to be elected. Doesn't that call for people to focus their energy on those powers then and make sure that they are counter-balanced by better laws that weaken the power of the head of state (the opposite of what Orbán has said he will do)? So the answer to the first 4 questions would be the party, parliament and the people (obviously not all of the people). There has been no vote of no confidence, nor is there anyone challenging his position... OK, so the question is why does the Garda and a reasonable number of people concentrate on Roma and Jews, rather than the legal framework and constitutional matters. It's like Umberto Eco's question of why Superman spends his time rescuing kittens rather than expend his energies on things that really matter. Why? Well, because some Hungarians (like you lot), prefer to moan and talk as if you know the solution and know what you are doing, rather than working for a solution. But more than this, a democracy is there for everyone, whether you like it or not, so you can't go round deciding who you represent. Data protection and the freedom of information are where energy needs to be expended.

It is deeply disturbing to see so many postings in this forum supporting an anti-democratic movement like the Magyar Garda. Hungary has a democratic system with separation of powers into an executive, a legislature, and a judiciary estate. This has proven to be a good and reliable system in modern democracies.

Hungarians should focus on strengthening their democratic system by fighting corruption and holding people accountable. This even starts on everybody's own doorstep. No need to point at any polititians, that's what elections are for. A strong democracy is able to fight any kind of crime effectively.

The mere claim by the Magayr Garda as a unitary system to be able to fight crime and restore order is anti-democratic and populist and the constant reference to ethnic minorities is plainly and simply racist.

The Magyar Garda's ideology, their behaviour, the form of the organisation, and their uniforms are a chilling reminder of Hitler's fascist apparatus of power.

Fight the crime in a democratic way. Don't let the frustration drag you into an anti-democratic dictatorship!

Ricsi,

I would love to see the jew garda guy in certain manifestations... anyway, this is the biggest proof to stupid fascists that the estereotype are out. Anyway, still lot easier to project in the others your own faliures. And, I belive there is a certain hierarchy when it is about the "dark side of the force"(consifering the Garda being the nobes Jedis as Vandarlo already put Superman to close to them in the history). So poor jews will be like that guys dressed in white, they don't really count. The Gipsies are ond step over, something like the children jedi in treining for the dark side. The black people would the the siths. And the emperor would be some jew owning any company or politician. The religious jews would be gosths.

After all this exercise just tell me... What is the final solution for the other 95% roma non tax payers?? (as if any comom hungary is any better than that, they just don't have the guts for)

May the force be with you.

Democrat,

Dont say "too many" suports for the Garda. There are just the same three stooges doing their number as usual. And, they were too close to Superman and Jedis today. Don't make them too proud. They use to believe in anything.

BTW, sorry for the lots of mispelings. I will try to be more careful.

Democrat,

"It is deeply disturbing to see so many postings in this forum supporting an anti-democratic movement like the Magyar Garda."

Don't be too deeply disturbed: Ricsi is here on a semi-professional basis, he moderates the Jobbik English language forum. He, HotP and Stan have all spent large periods of their lives outside of Hungary, and their self-identification with the cause of "real" Hungarians is not too hard to fathom. I think if they were uncomplicatedly Hungarian, they would be posting elsewhere in Hungarian.

It will be interesting to see how this "dissolution" plays out: will the Guard pack up their uniforms and flags and take up growing vegetables or building model railways? Will the police and the courts enforce the ban? Who knows, but it could provide Gyurcsány with an interesting alternative political story to run as Hungary slides into recession and maybe worse next year. That will be the real test of Hungarian democracy.

Magyar Guarda are only going to grow, this is a patriotic voluntary movement which developed because of group of wise people could see the writting on the wall for the future of where Hungary was heading, and without their proactive stand there would have been no other alternative to highlight the criminal cheats currently in power. Jobbik are not scared to speak out to defend Hungarians rights and try to develop a positive future for it’s people at the same time highlighting what is going on in the global environment, people are wising up to how democracy is not how it appears, the capitalistic system is collapsing just look at the world economic climate, if you look at how the IMF, Media control, Elite agenda operate and there tactics for power you will soon see that Jobbik are the only party speaking out about this and revealing the truth on the circumstances and what direction the country has to go to get out of the recession.
@Adrian may Jesus Christ raise your consciousness to see the true reality, Szebb Jovot! :-)

Some retard has used my name in vain again.
The post at 4:25 PM is from a fake Stan, not the real one (me). It's so not cool to impersonate others. The posts at 10:59 AM and 1:46 PM are mine (if that wasn't obvious), but 4:25 PM is a really bad forgery, and should be removed by the moderators.

Reni
Me thinks you are hitting the bottle !!!
You are waffling too much and generally talking shit, sober up and please rejoin the debate.

AdrianD
Doing your best at character assassination again I see !! At least you found the guts to do it on the same thread this time you hypocrite .

Stan
Do not worry, it was most obviously not you .This site is been plagued with childish impersonators,too cowardly to make their own comments. Usually hiding behind "anonymous" tags or stealing others names,or making cowardly comments on other threads.

@Stan: Stanny-boy don't lie, we all know it was you. Your last comments have been bordering on the confessional and now you're beginning to crack. After all, isn't Stan just a nickname for you being a Stakhanovite (стахановец) back in the old regime?

Stan, whilst reading that 4.25 comment I was assuming it was sarcasim towards Reni, thanks for highlighting that some twats are manipulating the comments.

Seems like Van Reni and Adrian are attending some Gay mardi gra, all a bunch of pillow bitters!

Vandorlo,
Yes, Stahanov is my hero, and they named the "Élmunkás Híd" after me.

@Hotpaprika: How old are you? You write and comment like a prepubescent teen going through a hormone change. Look, it's much easier to make pathetic jokes about you lot - I mean you are the ones who enjoy dressing up in uniform with other men and prancing around in your free time. See how cretinous that level of discourse is? No? Get over it, come to terms with it and stop over-compensating. It's a scary world we live in and self-knowledge doesn't come to us all. Anyway, you couldn't possibly be gay, your lack all basic insight into yourself and others and your world view is so myopic you have obviously led far too sheltered a life. This is a discussion about democracy, the basis of it, the legitimate rights and boundaries in which it is exercised etc... It's not about silly name calling. Any if you do make a joke, change the batteries in your corpus collosum first. n.b. No offence meant to gays, straights, bisexuals, transexuals, posttraumaticsexuals...

@Van
I haven’t the energy to waste debating with ignorant neo liberals of you sort, you have no constructive argument only hide behind the facade of democracy which is proven failure here and many countries, the resent elections in the US was not democracy, it was the puppet whom was controlled by the media whom one the election, The USA is a theocratic aristocracy!! This is one of many examples of money manipulates votes. Sadly it is common knowledge that congress is owned and controlled by corporations and the wealthy. So dont use your empty argument to try and ridicule me you poof!

“It is precisely in its oppression of nonmarket forces that we see how neoliberalism operates not only as an economic system, but as a political and cultural system as well. Here the differences with fascism, with its contempt for formal democracy and highly mobilized social movements based upon racism and nationalism, are striking. Neoliberalism works best when there is formal electoral democracy, but when the population is diverted from the information, access, and public forums necessary for meaningful participation in decision making. As neoliberal guru Milton Friedman put it in his Capitalism and Freedom, because profit-making is the essence of democracy, any government that pursues antimarket policies is being antidemocratic, no matter how much informed popular support they might enjoy. Therefore it is best to restrict governments to the job of protecting private property and enforcing contracts, and to limit political debate to minor issues. (The real matters of resource production and distribution and social organization should be determined by market forces.)”

Neoliberalism goes beyond issuing structural adjustments. It puts pressure on developing (as well as “developed”) societies to practice a superficial form of democracy at best, so that when it comes to such fundamental issues to a society as its very means of production and wealth distribution, the masses are left out of the discussion, let alone the drawing board. Elections in many third world countries, particularly in Africa and the Caribbean, and even perhaps in the United States itself, are often superficial affairs whose primary campaign features are veiled promises of ethnic nepotism, shallow populist theater, and vagaries about opposing corruption. This should come as no surprise given that in the current world order, questions about models of production, development choices, and class conflict are to be left to the tiny cabal of the world’s economic taskmasters and social engineers. Neoliberalism is thus a practice of engaging in economic corporate-finance capital totalitarianism behind a wall of falsely comforting, superficial, and practically insignificant democracy and “people’s choice.”

all the above thanks too..

http://lionsroar.wordpress.com/2008/01/11/more-on-neoliberalism-polyarchy-and-false-democracy/

@Hotpaprika: "I haven’t the energy to waste debating with..." Democracy is about debating, compromise and finding enough energy to make the instruments of democracy better. It isn't about imposing your view on others undemocratically, which is what the Garda and their supporters stand for. It's as simple as that. There is no *right* answer, but through respecting each other's difference of opinion and lifestyle we all get to live our imperfect lives in an imperfect peace. But at least we have equality of opportunity to make the most of our lives for the good of ourselves and others. You keep telling us that this isn't democracy, well what is? Tell me the principles, give me the charter, point me to the constitution. In Hungarian or English, which ever is easier for you to write grammatically.

Vándorlo

This is a open forum and he his typing from his heart,not writing a University thesis so why do you idiots always throw in the "spelling "or "grammatically correct" issue ?? Can't argue against his comments,so let's try to ridicule his writing style ??. I see it all the time on the internet--usually from people who make countless mistakes themselves.
Grow up ,open your eyes or just get a life please.
Good night

@Ricsi: But he isn't "writing from his heart" as he clearly doesn't understand the chunks of text he has just cut-and-pasted in, or can he follow the reductum ad absurdum of his own arguments - and it isn't even far from his starting point. He, like you talk in headlines, without the knowledge or will to develop those headlines into clear discourse. So, since you're sticking up for your mentally inebriated kith and kin perhaps you can answer the points. Where is your charter, principles and/or constitution under which your version of 'democracy' works? So far, you, Stan and Hotpaprika have just shown yourselves to be pathetic bolsheviks/dictators in waiting. Where is your constitution? What are your principles? Where is the description of your form of government and how people can control it. Who has the power in it and how is it decided who and how that power is distributed? Answer the sodding questions.

Vándorló (Sorry about the previous mis-spelling
,its late !! )

Just for your sake tonight I will refer you to the Bethlan Gábor programme of Jobbik.com.
There you will find all your answers.

One other thing,Please never compare me to any Bolshevik for God's sake !

The English language site is been upgraded as we speak,but Jobbik.com Hungarian is still on line if it helps,if not happy reading tomorrow !

Good night and peace to all. (except Bolsheviks !!)

Hahahaha!! The three stooges must be only one person. Please. There is not that number of people lost like that in this world.

Acording to them I am a drunk gay who cannot argue. Well, this looks like the most beautiful exercise of dialetic.
BTW nobody answer me what would be the "final solution" for the 95% of the roma people?

Guy(s) you mix up capitalism with democracy and not even have humor. The only think that makes me happy is that people like you dies very early from a heart attack. And, you should start believing that there is a conspiration behind all medication. The gay black jews are behind everything, I heard it. Please don't take any medicine.

Did my coment toke out your energy to dabate? So please don't spend your keybord and averybodies brains blablablaing something else. Get tired. Got to sleep. Don't forget to eat something very havy before.

"Gay Black Jews" , talk about the Holy Trinity of hate mongering, definitely counts as "three strikes your out" right? I see what has happened in Hungary, a group of passionate patriots has taken a stand to correct what they see as an ineffective or indifferent government approach to the needs of the country. They form together with like minded individuals and develop a credo and begin to attract attention. Unfortunately, neo liberalism immediately implements their highly effective onslaught of misinformation and character assassination in the media and paints the group as a Hungarian version of the KKK! Now they are declared illegal when all they want to do is bring attention to the ills of the country. Not being an expert on the Hungarian constitution, I would wonder what happened to the "right of free assembly and association"? Right or wrong in their actions, the Magyar Guarda should still have the right to exist.

I want the MAZSIHISZ to be disbanded next. Then the Gypsy Authority and whatever organization gays have. And the MSZP while we're at it. All these are "triggering fear" in me, so they must go.

The fear that the guard trigger is rational.

@Ricsi (the Christmas dwarf Hotpaprika and big-fish-in-a-small-pond man Stan): "I will refer you to the Bethlan Gábor programme..." Well great, because there is nothing indexed on that on your site: http://www.jobbik.com/?s=Bethlan+G%C3%A1bor So the questions still remain and I don't care which one of you answers it: "Where is your constitution? What are your principles? Where is the description of your form of government and how people can control it. Who has the power in it and how is it decided who and how that power is distributed." You say you know what democracy is, share it - or is it just for the new chosen people?

@Ricsi: Even google doesn't bring any results for that on your site. Try the specific inter website search "site:http://www.jobbik.com/ Bethlan Gábor" and there are *zero* results. If you have no answers and policies, if you don't have an alternative and just like to moan and whinge like children, it's OK to admit it, it's Christmas, we'll forgive you.

@Ricsi: OK, over on the Hungarian site there's one PDF on the 'Bethlen Gábor program', but all this contains is the usual right-wing motherland stuff. There is nothing on the basic issues you, Stan and Hotpaprika go on about when you talk about democracy and a new way: "Where is your constitution? What are your principles? Where is the description of your form of government and how people can control it. Who has the power in it and how is it decided who and how that power is distributed." The Bethlen Gábor program as you call it is just a carbon copy of any countries right leaning politics, but there is nothing in there on constitutional matters. Point me to the documents and policies through which you are governed, how you vote and how the law courts/constitutional courts will counter-balance your power with an effective police force in ordre to ensure that 'no-one is above the law' and everyone is answerable to the people. Show me the real documents not this vacuous rag.

HotP,

thanks for the link, and the Xmas wishes, viszont.

For the record, I agree with much of the the analysis of neoliberalism you cite. The problem is that there are no neo-liberal states, maybe the US in the 18th early 19th century. Hungary certainly isn't a neo-liberal democracy. For example, it pays my wages and I'm a school teacher. I also think that one way Hungarians could have a better life is through more voluntary institions. The National Trust, Barnado's, charitably founded schools and colleges even the Boyscouts all contribute positively to life in the UK.

The Boyscouts brings us on to the issue of the Guard, Szekes remarks that the media "paints the group as a Hungarian version of the KKK". This is also true, and it's a convincing caricature for western ex pats because it is difficult for us to understand exactly what the Guard is for. We don't have equivalent institutions in our home countries.

Like the boyscouts, the guard have uniforms and flags, unlike the boyscouts part of their agenda is to police crime. My only experience of a non-state, uniformed, "vigilante" movement is the Cossacks in Southern Russia during Yeltsin's (lack of) government. They were dirty, aggressive and armed. Their main purpose was the extortion of fines from roadblocks and harrassing the Caucasian minorities. The Guards I have seen have been clean, non-aggressive and unarmed, but roadblocks and the focus on "gypsy" crime have not been inventions of the media.

@Adrian
Magyar Garda have openly clearly stated when and where they will protest, the road blocks were justified for the Slovakian oppression of the Hungarian minorities in Felvidek and the bashing of the Soccer Fan, also highlighting the Gypsy crimes within our country where our so called police force are not protecting the Hungarian people. Garda have worked within the Hungarian legal boundaries and even now they have been oppressed by the system, these guys are not bashing Gypsies or Slovaks, they just want to support the Hungarians.
Anyone! doesn’t matter what creed or religion, if they are for the Hungarian interests! and not exploiting our nation! Jobbik support! Garda are there to uphold the law as loyal citizens. We don’t believe the minorities should dictate to the majority and pollute the minds and culture that exists in Hungary. Hungarians in the past history have always protected minorities and these minorities keep turning against the Hungarians, this is how Neo liberal Human rights is manipulated by these minority groups, dirty filthy politics.

Merry Christmas

The Hungarian Guard Movement is not affected by the verdict, even the Judge confirmed this. The verdict is about the Association. Indirectly the court confirmed that the Guard will carry on and I can also confirm this. The Guard serve the nation and the Holy Crown of Hungary. quoted by Vona Gabor.. ;-)

To tell you the truth, it did move me as I have seen the Garda collecting toys etc…for xmas to help Hungary’s less fortunate children. Me, personally congratulate them. It’s wonderful! Of course they have the right to exist,
****as does the KKK (hate organization), religious, military organizations etc… ,*****

Good point from Adrian D “for western ex pats because it is difficult for us to understand exactly what the Guard is for” ….

It is not clear, that’s all!

It is okay to be a radical, since Hungary today belongs to the EU, the radical “party” must align their global mission to complement that process. Clarify the values you believe in, and this can be done no more than 10 statements.

“To be truly radical is to make hope possible rather than despair convincing.” Raymond Williams

dave says: "The fear that the guard trigger is rational."

Why?

Unfortunately after getting smashed in the mainstream media over and over again by the negative publicity most westerners go into auto pilot mode, and automatically box the Garda and Jobbik into a radical group, and when you personally experience and witness what there real cause is then your views start to change, this is where the media is so tactful and goes to prove that journalism and freedom of the press is biased, which reveals there true agenda to divide and rule, our mainstream media is a scam!

Here's a short educational video about the nice folks afraid of the Guard:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTr0H4xsjN8

@Stan, Hotpaprika, Ricsi: you keep talking about democracy. Are any of you intelligent and articulate enough to actual say what on earth you are talking about, or is it just words for you lot. Spell it out and don't be such a cowardly bolsheviks. And why you try to explain your neo-paramilitary groupie love as some form of anomie you still have to explain why it takes this form and what on earth its aim is and for whom. For me you are clearly followers of the 'retreatism' branch of social/cultural deviance (look up Merton if you are having problems with this) and not in the rebellion category as your words would have others believe. And Hotpaprika, you need to read the judges ruling more closely, he clearly stated a reciprocal relationship of symbiosis, which political analysts are currently divided on their interpretations of, but the Garda are certainly not free to prance around willy-nilly.

Van
Democracy does not exist! how clear do you want me to spell it out! It's the power elite creating the illusion of democracy! Jobbik have reiterated several times.. Many other parties are promoting this illusion and Jobbik are highlighting this. And Van why try and complicate this it's plain black and white!

@Van
I realise it must be difficult for you to accept this because I assume you have believed in this illusion of democracy, or even invested some hard earned study and your ego is that stubborn that it's in deniel, snap out of it boy!! And if you awaken , just remember we are not your enemy we will be here to support you and each another. God bless!

@Hotpaprika: Then what is your form of government, how are you elected and who decides?

Democracy my ass, just look at the EU referendum in Ireland, they voted NO, so was the voice of the people accepted, NO they are forcing another vote on them to get the decision they want.

@John Simpson: The EU doesn't pass the test of a democratic institution, but your implicit argument would be then that it's not worth trying anywhere and any alternative goes and it's for anyone to take control and govern others against their will, without a clear mandate and ability to replace those in power, decide what powers they have and how those powers are used? Let's try to stay focussed on the simple question you cowards/inebriates have yet to answer: Then what is your form of government, how are you elected and who decides? I'm making it simpler for you so you can follow. Read it out load to yourself if it helps you to understand it.

John Simpson.

Absolutely correct,we are seeing the return of "stalinism" was it also not true that those countries (Hungary included)that signed the treaty without offering a referendum (no problem for an ex-commie like Gyurcsány) were not even allowed to read and study the document first. Democracy ??
Also read the report between Vaclav Havel and the Irish EU minister ,Good for Havel " I have never heard anything like this in 19 years "

Vandorlo,
A democratic system will have to do until we come up with something better. The problem is that it's not working. First we must clean up the election process, then introduce some level of trasnparency and accountability, so our elected crooks will not steal everything. The public should be encouraged to get informed and involved. Elected officials are the employees of the people, we have to tell them what we want and let them figure out how to do it. If they are corrupt or stupid, we need a legal way of replacing them. Stuff like that...

Stan,

"The problem is that it's not working"

I agree with everything in your last post, especially "The public should be encouraged to get informed and involved". But it is nothing more than a vague wish list. What concrete proposals do you have, reform of the electoral system for instance?

Aha, the court says that the Hungarians are not entitled to a defense force. Is that not the definition of an occupation.

Interesting article.
But more interesting comments.

I have to admit that Vandorlo has the better agrument. Although, I am not Maygar, I do have a particular interest in the country and its politics. So far from everything I've read I do not agree whole hearted with the Guard. I agree, Hungary needs to be fixed but this is an issue that will take time. There are corrupt people in government and the populous need to have something to believe in. Corrupt people do not equal democracy, they just give it a bad name. Democracy is a great thing. (And please do not confuse Capitalism with Democracy, they are 2 different things.)

Anyways, if the Guard could just focus on Hungary, its issues, and not be anti-semetic, anti-gay, anti-gyspy, and/or anti-"non-maygar people" then the Guard could prove to be something good. Hungary honestly needs to reinvest in itself. The previous *communist* government are the ones that whored out Hungary (and no, communism is not democracy either.)
thanks....k

One of the most entertaining threads on this forum for some time!
Vándorló, I think I've criticized you before but I take it back because you are clearly the voice of reason in this discussion.
The Magyar Gárda being dissolved is one of the best (and funniest) Christmas presents Hungary has had this year. Look out for them re-emerging with a new name and new uniform early in the new year.

Lefty Xmas greetings, progressive peace and neo-liberal goodwill to all (especially Jews, black people, gay people, Roma people...) :-)

Yes wait when the Droids will be knocking at your door, and you will have a microchip stuck in your anal, oops!! the gays will enjoy this, they will probably have vibrating mico chipped butt plugs.