Well, as obviously false the "only right-wingers hate the Gypsies" trope is (and utterly loathesome as the Veres clan is) I'd be surprised if Szabó didn't say this "unspeakable" thing in the spirit Nyakó suggested. Still, it does go to show you how stilted the public debate is.

Erik. It is your friend - two noughts and a zed
again from outer space:
"Hindus laud Hungary hospital for attempt to honor Roma traditions.
Hindus have commended the hospital in Hungary town of Gyongyos for reportedly setting up a special room for Roma patients and their visitors to practice their cultural rituals.
Acclaimed Hindu statesman Rajan Zed, in a statement in Nevada (USA) today, described it as a “step in the right direction” and urged other hospitals of Hungary also to make similar accommodations to speed-up the integration of Roma."
(B.T. Nov 10)
Ciganyok cultural rituals? - Passing round the palinka bottle in celebration of more free help?

@Erik: Couple this with the news item showing that
the MSZP couldn't even be bothered to turn up at
the meeting looking into the Roma serial murders (
http://bit.ly/48wdCq ) and you can see why people
are pretty clear that the only thing that really
matters to these people is holding onto power and
their party, not the people they pretend to serve.
You can dress up Éva Szabó's statements any way
you want but she did claim that these women were
willing to harm their own children for financial
gain. How could that possibly be spun as
demonstrating her 'despair and desire to help'
("aggodalom és a segítő szándék"). Perhaps this is
a MSZP euphemism for not giving a shit about
others or common decency?
Q: Why did you place your family in that state
job?
A: 'despair and a desire to help'
Q: Why get rid of the most popular radio channels
and put your own in place.
A: 'despair and a desire to help'
Q: Why are you under and over valuing state
property?
A: 'despair and a desire to help'
Q: Why is your holiday paid for by tax payers?
A: 'despair and desire to help'
Q: Your free and exclusive medical care:
A: 'despair and desire to help'
...
Yep, works just as well for anything they are
involved in.
Could be their new campaign slogan?

and here some entertainment

jewish klezmer against gypsy music duell

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bQmT1EM0Eg

for the culture lovers....

to take the brain of the real issues...:)

@Erik: "how stilted the public debate is..." How stilted is it? &, look who is talking... Gypsy media are more honest than you: Akit negyvenezer forintért adtak el romáknak | Cigány család tartotta három évig rabszolgasorban Újkígyóson a 69 esztendős Feri bácsit, akire lapunk a Magyar Ökumenikus Szeretetszolgálat egyik szállásán lelt rá. Az idős férfi csicskáztatóival szemben mindössze csalás miatt folyik nyomozás a Békéscsabai Rendőrkapitányságon, nem pedig emberkereskedelem, testi sértés és/vagy személyi szabadság megsértése címén… http://➡.ws/狾씍 ( check out those Gypsy comments! ) All this is not news for you, right? Gyps barbecuing someone wouldn't be news for you ( people :) Thorpe of all people has been more progressive lately than your pitiful kehillah Hungary's 'forgotten' war victims www.➡.ws/ The deportation in 1944 of thousands of Hungary's civilians to the Soviet Union, although on a similar scale to the deportation of its Jewish people to the death camps, receives little official attention in Hungary, as Nick Thorpe reports… )

@Erik, continued: And look what _he is up against: www.➡.ws/뷜 'Dispatches investigates one of the most powerful and influential political lobbies in Britain, which is working in support of the interests of the State of Israel…' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1tPulSggyA&feature=related (Channel 4 )

@Erik, more: Budapest Times asked Vona to contribute! 'the great and supposed defenders of democracy who have so compelled the treaty’s trans-European acceptance in an entirely anti-democratic manner. Leaving out, of course, the European electorate in the process; and placing the decision in the hands of an infinitely corruptible political elite…' http://www.budapesttimes.hu/content/view/13447/219 Why can't you? And while you're at it, ask an opposing opinion as well, such as Csurka's :) Read the handwriting on he wall already, will you? Te bibas www.➡.ws/ᡨ

wow! Pavaszem worked for two weeks after the last posting here until he could come up with enough nonsense ...

That statement in the Budapest Times by the "jobbik leader" shows very nicely one of the problems: He says absolutely nothing important about the real world just bla, bla, bla ... just complaining that the Czechs and the Polish have it better or whatever he means...

wolfie, please find a nice german nazi list where you can spread your wisdom

Jobbik will re-open the matter of the Lisbon Treaty because it has been anti-democratically imposed onto the nations of Europe
(Vona Gabor in the linked article)
---
Yet more BS that shows how untrue the anti-EU Mafia is.
The treaty was accepted by the rules that each member country in their own wisdom and sovereignty decided on.
If the EU, or 'Brussels' as the anti-EU Mafia fancy to call it, had prescribed that it *must* be referendums between 2 general elections, etc or whatever, then the anti-EU Mafia had complained the sovereignty of the EU member states was under attack.
-
The good thing with the Lisbon Treaty is exactly this as Vona calls
"If the Czech or the Polish President had the nerve to hold the whole of Europe to ransom, why did ours not?"
will now finally have an end.
-
How democratic was it, when the Czech President, publicly unelected (assigned by the majority of Czech MPs) can hold over 500 million citizens to ransom?
This is the type of 'cooperation' Vona and Jobbik and the rest of this anti-EU Mafia is looking for.
Not seeking out what the majority can readily accept, just what the few load-mouths can push through.
This is the myth of the 'Strong Leader' personified.
-
Both Poles and Czechs will pay a price for their 'ransom prize'. Believe me, who can trust them in the future and who is willing to work closely with someone who stab you in the back later?
Look up Pyrrhic victory...

Vona Gabor - An erudite scholar and a true Hungarian? The list of useless Hungarian politicians continues: Gyurscany Ferenc, Bajnai Gordon, Ildikó Lendvai, Vona Gabor, the current justice and finance ministers et al, etc. etc.
Totally and utterly,useless pricks, with not an ounce of sense in reality is what they are.
The mayhem will continue in this
beleaguered country until a new breed of politician is found that can at least reason that 2+2 = 4. That is to say,unless you have both hands in the till and the days takings have flown out the window to an offshore company in Cyprus.
Unborn, Roma babies are, of course, top priority at the moment.

@LouisX1V
Vona is the one we Jews hate most because he thinks that Hungary belongs to Hungarians. We want Hungary and we got our Jewish Communist brothers and sisters in the MSZP and SZDSZ to get it done for us. Vona is trouble…

Bernie,
You should really pop over to StormFront.
They have a whole department there dealing with that Vona Gabor is a 'jewish agent'.
Why else would he have changed name...
Another sign is that Jobbik has no problems with Jews as members, only the other members have like, Ricsi, Law etc.

@Louis: "The mayhem will continue in this beleaguered country until a new breed of politician is found that can at least reason that 2+2 = 4" Such as who? Give me a positive example anywhere in Europe -- or anywhere.
@Viking: "Poles and Czechs will pay a price… who is willing to work closely with someone who stab you in the back later?" Poles and the Czech, certainly, have always been backstabbers and traitors or haven't you heard of their behavior before, during and after the two most recent world wars? Anglo clients too, guilty of such crimes against humanity as the Beneš decrees. None of which stopped them from thriving as far as I can see… At any rate, does EU membership benefit Hungary at all or is it just another disaster for us? Can you even name any specific benefits that makes it worthwhile for us to be a member of this corrupt-sóhivatal-US-client union? PS: Here http://bit.ly/3PktEu is the Thorpe link again: it doesn't seem to work in the original comment. Plus there is a wonderful, touching interview http://www.echotv.hu/20091127_ejjeli_menedek.html (video, EchoTv) with the elder Szögi daughter (Mr Szögi's the teacher that was kicked to death by a Gypsy mob in front of his two young daughters in 2006).

Can you even name any specific benefits that makes it worthwhile for us to be a member of this corrupt-sóhivatal-US-client union?
Pávaszem at December 3, 2009 9:54 AM
---
The best argument will always be that it is better to be inside, than outside.
Not that I think you will agree on that, but at least you cannot give an example that it would have been better to be outside than inside, then such would be an impossible 'What-If'-argument, based on wishful thinking on events would have gone your way.
Well they do not, they do not go my way either, so it is just to try to make the best of the current situation, and that is inside the Union instead of outside.
Europe, for which you never cared anything about, has never been as strong as it is now, but there are big challenges ahead, mainly from Russia, your and your fellow Jobbos best friend.

Pávaszem. It is not up to me to find intelligent and honest politicians - they must be home-grown.
I don't care about politicians from other countries.
I read Petöfi Sandor's scribblings and I believe he would be a good role model for anybody wanting to enter the political arena.
Gyurscany Ferenc was prime minister for five years or more. How did he get to become leader of this nation? It speaks volumes about the electorate and politicians that standards have hit rock bottom.

There is a saying in development circles that 'the only thing worse than being exploited by rich western powers is not being exploited by rich western powers.' ...it's similar to Viking's better to be on the inside than the outside. Also, I have heard many Hungarians talk of the alliance with Germany as 'tragically choosing the wrong side', as though it were merely a matter of choosing the side mostly likely to win. I don't see how this would be much different. (I'm trying for irony there)

I have heard many Hungarians talk of the alliance with Germany as 'tragically choosing the wrong side', as though it were merely a matter of choosing the side mostly likely to win
Cináed at December 4, 2009 1:31 PM
---
Those Hungarians should ponder of the choice the Italians made.
The Italians played both teams.
In the beginning with the Germans.
In the end against the Germans.
At least they tried.
One can just speculate how it would have been different if Horthy had not chosen his private life before the life of his country and actually ordered the Hungarian Army to resist the Germans.
Of course an impossible 'What If?'-game, but it shows that there are always alternatives, always choices to make.
What will be Good and what will be Bad is hard to say in advance, but the intention counts in the history books.

@Viking:

Nobody profited (at least in the long run) from working with Hitler and his Nazis.

I don't want to start a big discussion, there has been so much written and said, I just have to tell you that I still don't really understand how the Nazis could take over Germany so easily and so quickly.

All in all their reign before the war was just 6 years, less than for example the MSZP's reign here, and look what they accomplished! - sorry for that really bad joke, but I had to say that.

I asked my parents and family who were not Nazis (my uncle lost his job as a newspaperman, went to Stalingrad and disappeared there without a trace like hundreds of thousands, my grandmother never knew how and where and when he had died).

They could not explain it to me, it seemed it "just happened". I think even most Nazis didn't see what was coming.

Well that is past, but I want to talk about the future here - and we all hope that nothing a nd no one like Hitler (or Stalin, Mussolini) will rise to power again - at least we don't have to be afraid of those silly jobbik jobos...

Wolfie,
We know the result, but what would have happened if Nazi-Germany had been stopped early, after the first aggressive acts in 1935-6?
If Hitler had not gone to war, the new Reich would have started to crack.
It takes 5-10 years to build up a country for war, all are focused, but no war = frustration and problems.
During these years between 1933 and 1939 Hitler actually delivered, no question of it.
He militarised the Rhine-area, took back Böhmen and Mähren and promised to do the same thing with the German areas under Polish control.
Any Hungarian leader that would be able just not to copy Hitler's Beer Hall rhetoric, but also deliver the same results regarding the Hungarian areas in the neighbouring countries, he (most likely) would be greatly admired and hailed as the Chief.
The up-hill battle such an Hungarian leader would have today, is that every one remembers Hitler.
And Chamberlain.
And Churchill.
And Milocevics.
If you were a Serb, you could basically ask the same question.

@Viking: I totally agree - but now something completely different:

Üvegtigris 2 is on TV2, one of my favorite Hungarian films - and you don't have to understand Hungarian to enjoy it!

Viking...I more or less agree with you on your recent posts. Hitler certainly did deliver in his early years in power, however, I question whether or not it was 'real' in the sense that his strategy was always leading towards a tipping point..ie war or economic collapse. I read JFK's "Why England Slept" in which he concludes that a dictatorship will always have an advantage over a democracy in the short-term in that it can easily commandeer resources and impose its will on the population, however, in the long-term, (established) democracies are more sustainable in that power is a property of the office, not only of the person...meaning that it is possible for power to be handed from one to the next leadership with a minimum of disruption.The course of Hitler's regime had to inevitably end in either glory or destruction, which I would argue was still ultimately a good thing.I would also argue that the invasion of the Soviet Union by the Axis powers gave the communists an opportunity to spread much farther than they otherwise would have been able.
I also agree that intention matters, although, I do remember Macnamara talking about the US firebombing of Japan, about which he said, 'If we had lost the war, we would have been war criminals'...pointing out that our sense of morality is very much influenced by whether or not we win. "Might makes right."

'If we had lost the war, we would have been war criminals'...pointing out that our sense of morality is very much influenced by whether or not we win. "Might makes right."
Cináed at December 5, 2009 4:02 AM
---
True, as I normally call it "History is written by the winners".
That is why we do not speak so much about Dresden and the Hunger Campaign in Bengal and Katyn during WWII.
They still happened, but 'wrong' side were the perpetrators.
They were though heavily used as propaganda tools by the Nazi-regime, which just shows that even 'the wrong side can be true'.
What we have seen lately, with its first steps, are the law suits against war criminals on all sides in the Yugoslav conflict.
It is a promising development, but still some way to go.

@Louis: "not up to [you] to find intelligent and honest politicians" Meaning that you couldn't find one single example? "they must be home-grown" No shit. Sounds like the secret of eternal life,we must never die... "Pet[ő]fi S[á]ndor… I believe he would be a good role model" Are you alluding to the fact that he was suicidal? "Gyurscany Ferenc" Should have done what? And what should he not have done and why? "standards have hit rock bottom [in Hungary]" Descending from the Zenith they were at? When? When did we have our 'golden age' and how were things different? And finally, what country could be in your not so humble opinion a role model for us, Louie? bro?
@Viking: "better to be inside, than outside" For you maybe. Since you're married to Herczog Edit http://➡.ws/筋 so, I really don't blame you for wanting her to be as far away from you a (sub)humanly possible while you share her humongous EU salary (that you probably blow on your reindeers… -- does she know about your reindeers?) "you cannot give an example that it would have been better to be outside than inside" You've got it backward again, Lapp. We don't do things because there is no reason not to do them! At any rate, if we were 'outside' Brussels at least wouldn't rip us off another bunch of billions which in itself is reason enough to stay out.

@Viking, continued: "Europe, for which you never cared..." Liar, liar pants on fire! "has never been as strong as it is now" Are you kidding? The EU with US occupied Germany and the US pillion traveler UK? We're just another client entity of the American empire for Christ's sake.