Cardinal Péter Erd has become a target of Jobbik after advising Catholic priests not to bless crosses erected in public places by the far-right party.
Speaking at a press conference last Thursday, he said priests should not perform such ceremonies in light of recent political events, although without mentioning Jobbik by name. There is no problem with setting up crosses in public places, but “we cannot be identified with their use as a political instrument” he warned.
Radical websites have since attacked Erd . Jobbik spokesman Előd Novák said erecting crosses is a religious rather than political act, so Catholic priests are still willing to bless the street crosses, adding that the cardinal’s statement has nowhere had any influence on priests.
One should not exaggerate the division between church and state, Novák remarked.
So now even the catholic church is part of the liberal leftist communist jewish conspiration against jobo “Patriots” – shame on them!
wolfi..
i am puzzled.. when you say liberal leftist, are you refering to the same people? because in my dictionary, being liberal or leftwinger (socialist) are the complete opposite: (individual vs. the common, freedom vs. state involvement, and so on) It is just us, stupid hungarian voters (and by extension politicians) who have a tendency to mix them both… the most reknown liberals (hayek, misses, thatcher, reagan etc) have always been the fierecst attackers of socialism. Besides, do remember that jobbik (or far-right movement) is just socialism “spiced” with a nationalistic touch, aiming for fustrated voters willing to blame all their misfortunes on someone else.
have a nice day…
@robi:
If you read (some of) the posts here you will find that for the jobbik jobos here this equation hold: Liberal = Leftist = Socialist = Jew = Communist and so on…
I and others like Viking and Vandorlo have been called all these and other names (a drunk Lapp or even a Jewish whore in the case of Olga!) by our resident fascist loonies like Pavaszem, Law, Bob…, Mark and so on …
These guys are typical representative of the so called “Hungarian Patriots” you find in fascist groups like Jobbik.
We know that there are of course other Hungarians, like my friends – and my beautiful wife who laughs at these silly creatures…
@robi
If you reserve jut as much scepticism for Hungarians who call everyone who disagrees with them “Liberal Lestifists,” as you do for Germans who call everyone who’d dare disagree with them “resident fascist loonies.”
Then I’ll sure you’ll get by here just fine.
One should not exaggerate the division between church and state, Novák remarked
—-
Yes, get back the State Religion.
Force all children to wear giant crosses on their neck and recite the Bible every morning.
School-Uniforms, that show ‘Christian Values’ should be enforced. If the parents cannot afford that, they should be jailed.
And of course a general ban on building synagogues and mosques and other non-Christian Religious Buildings.
Is the above the future ‘Christian Hungary’ according to Jobbik?
Question is maybe if it should be Catholic or Protestant?
—
On another note – it is interesting that it is the Catholic Church that has this problem.
I really believe the extreme-right in Hungary, as ‘Magyars’ is actually more well-connected to the Hungarian Reformed Church.
Could be that the Catholic church is better connected to the Schwab, the 2nd biggest minority in Hungary, where there is a traditional resistance to forced ‘Magyarisation’ and since the 1980s an upswing in Schwab self-confidence and wanting to preserve the German culture that they stand for.
Interesting comments Viking and opens up a whole
litany of issues for debate.
Wolfi. I like you. But your over-simplification of some issues is reprehensible. Jobbik and Magyar Garda should be judged on deeds rather than words.
The blessing of crosses? Who gives a damn?
The Church, National Socialism, Communism, all mighty fallible as far as I am concerned. History confirms it. The Spanish Inquisition, The Crusades,
Catholicism v Protestantism – How many have died in this division of the sacred Faith?
Hungary needs to resolve its problems- Jobbik think they can do it with the help of the Magyar Garda. We are sceptical, but let’s give them a chance? Otherwise you will have the same old communist cranks stealing our money, hearts, and souls.
@ Igaz
Re – “The blessing of crosses? Who gives a damn?”
I gather Cardinal Peter Erd did. I would assume he did not appreciate the Cross being used as a political tool.
Moreover, he may not appreciate JOBBIK calling itself a “Christian Party” while espousing very un-Christian views.
Now he has become a target for JOBBIK – these brave Magyars really don’t take criticism or opposite views very well, do they?
I know, Cardinal Erd is a Communist. No need to post it.
@Igaz: You wrote “Jobbik and Magyar Garda should be judged on deeds rather than words.”
Well I’m from Germany. There some people said similar things about Hitler and his SA etc – suddenly it was too late, when they saw their deeds. Many people were totally surprised by what happened very fast in 1933. Of course I don’t believe Jobbik will ever come to power – but I just can’t stand their hate-mongering, just look at their sites – they almost make me throw up!
PS: the same goes for the hateful comments some jobos (That’s my name for those Jobbik sympathisers from USA, Australia and who knows where) have been spewing at honest people like Viking, Vandorlo or Olga – it almost makes me ashamed of humanity!
Hope that we have one or two Hungarians who can read this post. I find it very true and very appropriate:
El innen hát! El a hamis papokkal…! – Péter Erdő és Gábor Iványi részére
http://internetfigyelo.wordpress.com/2009/12/09/el-innen-hat-el-a-hamis-papokkal/
“Barátunk és küzdőtársunk Lengyel Károly, igaz hívő magyar ember lévén nem tarthatta magában gondolatait, nem engedhette meg azt a luxust, hogy a nemzetrontó lelkésznek és főpapnak eszébe ne juttassa Jézus szavait. Teszi ezt egy egyszerű ember, aki úgy is él, gondolkodik és cselekszik hazájáért, ahogyan azt felelősséggel mindenkinek tennie kellene. A hazaszeretet azonban sokakban kimúlt, azokban pedig, akiknek dolguk a magyar nemzet lelki támogatása lenne, megnyilatkozásuk szerint talán sosem volt. Ezek a gondolatok közvetlenül eljutottak a lelkész és a főpap drótposta-fiókjaiba.”
Jesus was not a Jew. History written by the Jews is
a load of Lies..
http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/12/03/jesus-was-
not-a-jew-benjamin-freedman/
@Danko Bacsi: I take it you have never read the bible then? http://jesusisajew.org/Jesus_is_a_Jew.php
DankoStinkoBacsi has really gone over the top:”Jesus was not a Jew.” – WTF has this ro do with Hungary’s problems of today ?
That’s an interesting read about Jesus not being a
Jew, this is old news.
Gee… it seems the fact’s are too much for the
kids.
Regarding this ethnic make-up of a poor carpenter aka ‘Jesus’:
From the link provided by the certified racist ‘Danko Bacsi’:
“Freedman (1890-1984) had been part of the American Zionist inner circle but, like Goldstein, converted to Christianity”
-
2 reflections:
a) That would not have saved him from the Hungarian Arrow Crosses, like ‘Danko Bacsi’, who did not, unlike the Germans, give a shit if a ‘jew “converted” or not, it was still a jew that needed to be killed’.
=
b) And since when did you Jew-haters ever trust a Jew?
–
You are 100% sure you are not being manipulated by Zionist Internet Forces to just look stupid?
@Danko Bacsi & Vándorló: Was Jesus a Jew is the wrong question. Are the Ashkenazim Jews is what you should ask. Are they the descendants of the biblical Hebrews? Because, if they are not, they must be the folks Revelation 2:9 mentions…
@Viking: “Hungarian Arrow Crosses, like ‘Danko Bacsi’, who did not, unlike the Germans, give a shit if a ‘jew’ converted” You are either lying or ignorant or (probably) both. Most Hungarian ‘Jews’ were simply exempt from the much needed apartheid laws, well over 80% — making possible the post war Stalinist terror I suppose… I bet you don’t even know that Dankó is a Gypsy name… Do you?
@Pávaszem: No the question is whether any of Jobbik are Christians, given their devout adherence to antinomianism.
Van. Do Jobbik leaders, supporters, understand the
term antinomianism, do you think?
Anyway, the Church has always believed in antinomianism. That is to say by way of definition: Christians are freed from the moral law by virtue of grace as set forth in the gospel. Alternatively- and/or people who maintain this.
The communists despised religion but had a similar way of putting a spin on things in order to achieve ultimate power. Remember Budapest 1956?
@antidisestablishmentarianism :
I like your nickname – this is my favorite English word – and comparing communism to a religion also has occurred to me quite often…
BTW: I am an atheist, just like my wife. The one thing that we BELIEVE in:
A pound of beef makes a good soup!
@Mark: “El a hamis papokkal…! – Péter Erdő és Gábor Iványi” Iványi úgy pap mint Barry Lynn lelkész, Darwin misszionárius vagy Stefan Bos keresztyén.
@Vándorló: “No the question is whether any of Jobbik are Christians,” I don’t think they are but why are you people so worried about their christianity all of a sudden? Submerging crosses in urine and calling it art is cool but erecting them in public bums you out… I mean His Eminence is right about using the Cross like that and Jobbik unfortunately just doesn’t get that but they are still a thousand times better than the gloating subhuman slime cheering the two sides on to kill one another. ( Which is one of the mainstays of your masters’ repertoire, yes? )
@wolfi “A pound of beef makes a good soup!” How about a pound of flesh, wolfi? Wouldn’t you prefer a pound of flesh?
Somehow I was not albe to view any new articles on this site, i’m not sure why. I was looking and yahoo led me to “refreshing my internet explorer cache” but I have no clue what the almighty ones are talking about~ Has anyone else had this problem or is it just me!?
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Just to push down the spam.
I found something on an American site, put up by an admirer of Sarah Palin who praises her “class and beauty”:
LIBERAL FILTH: Almost exclusively politicians and sycophants, these are the animals who wish to rule by decree, by judicial fiat, against the clear wishes of the populace. Includes such groups as Planned Parenthood and the ACLU.
Filth are in favor of late-term abortion on demand, despise free speech, work to overturn child molester laws, are big fans of genetic engineering, despise Christians, want to outlaw gun ownership, etc.
Sounds familiar ?
Wolfi. The spam bastards have plagued this, and sister sites, for a long time. It is Erik and co that should remove, or, put in a filter to deal with it.
Palin? Oh my goodness – she is more annoying than spam.
Great to have pol.hu back after the malware scare.
BTW. Frogs keep taking shelter in my garage when it rains. I thought their natural habitat was water
and lush green vegetation. My dusty, dry, dirty garage, full of junk does not qualify.
Whatever next, Umbrellas?!
@Wolfi and Frogmann,
@Wolfi,
That’s what I don’t understand…what do you mean by ‘pushing down the spam’? Why is it so important to get it off the recent comments area/display…you know which area I’m talking about. The one on the right of the screen.
@Frogmann,
Your post reminded me of some cartoons I grew up with. Bugs Bunny, Sylvester the Cat, Foghorn Leghorn, Elmer Fudd were some of the characters in ‘Looney Tunes’. I’m sure if you rifle through them, you’re bound to find a frog with an umbrella. At the very least, a frog wearing a top hat and walking stick
Since we’re posting irrelevant comments to the article above…I’ve got one.
Watched a movie yesterday called ‘The Stoning Of Soraya M’. Movie is based on a true story.
Guess, I don’t need to tell people what this movie is about, since the title is self explanatory. Pretty brutal…still a must see.
In the opening credits,
” Don’t act like the hypocrite
Who thinks he can conceal his wiles
While loudly quoting the Koran”
Hafez, 14Th century Iranian poet
When I saw this, reminded me of the conversation that had gone on here on Politics a few days back.
@justasking:
I just hate those stupid spam messages and I’m probably not the only one – usually pretty soon some other comment “pushes them down”.
That’s an expression from computer lingo: You have a “stack” of items, where only the top item is on direct view, so if you add another item, this becomes the top pushing the other down and becomes the one seen by others …
So now I’m pushing down your comment, see ?
@Wolfi,
D
Yeah, well some of us like being on top
I like my wife to be on top …
Hey! Someone deleted all that spam – well not all of it …
Wolfi. That is too much information. I understand that you are an extra, extra, extra, large, (XXXl)
individual and your natural habitat should be outside the boudoir.
Hi.justasking. It seems that you are in a talkative and calm mood. Maybe I can change that.
BTW I don’t care who is on top when I am having fun.
The local school ma’am gave me a very inviting look
today. I nearly fell off my bike…
One unfortunate frog got squashed under the door.
I only discovered it because it was exuding a very foul smell indeed.
@froggman:
maybe you could send some of your frogs over to feed on the “spanish snails” that have eaten almost all of my neighbours’ vegetables …
Or maybe you would be interested in having them for dinner yourself ?
@FroggmanHenry,
D
Trust Wolfi to take a somewhat ‘innocent’ comment…and run with it. I too have a bad habit of doing just that…
“BTW I don’t care who is on top when I am having fun”
FroggmanHenry at September 14, 2010 8:03 PM
Dude, you set me up…I tried…I just can’t let this one go…
So, by your own admission…everything is game? Animals, men…:D
Regarding ‘the school ma’am’…a guys gotta do what a guys gotta do in this life.
BUT…are you sure she was giving you ‘the look’?
Are you sure she did not have a simple case of gas and was expelling it? You never know.
She could be lactose intolerant and could not resist a that insistent co-working, encouraging her to ‘try just a little bit of this cream filled torte’. Lactose intolerance wreaks havoc with ones GI tract. Trust me I know.
Both looks are similar…longing…and the sweet release from the inability to digest lactose.
In regards to the frog who had the unfortunate luck of being caught underneath a door…I hope you had the decency to give the little guy a proper burial.
Ribbit, ribbit…
justasking. I threw it on the adjacent cornfield.
It frightened the crows, too, with its foul odour.
The school ma’am is a very decent woman and smells (unlike the frog) very sweet indeed.
BTW. I did predict that I could change your attitude simply by scratching the surface and revealing the ‘real’ you!
Wolfi. I hate snails and will leave the ingestion of same to you.
All this is very relevant to low wages and high prices and useless politicians in Hungary – I’m sure.
The teacher under discussion receives 130,000 huf per month, salary.
Equates to 450 euros or, 380 GBP. Hardly covers the gas and electricity bills.
If something is ‘rotten’ and ‘smelling’ in the state of Denmark surely it is this travesty of justice.
My friend in Budapest (also a teacher) receives the same pittance and is under great pressure to even find the monthly rent on his flat.
These are the facts. This is the reality. Shops and businesses also struggling and closing by the minute.
The provinces are dying on their feet, and cities are in decline.
Where have all the flowers/money gone???
And, finally, my dear friend, Bystander. I do live here and enjoy life irrespective of the corrupt and inept way this country is run.
I also make valid contributions to society beyond stoking the flames on this merry-go-round.
@frogman:
Maybe you forgot or haven’t read that I also live (at least 50 % of the year) in Hungary.
Even here around Héviz people struggle evry day – many need a second or even third job to “stay over water” (as we say in German) – especially those who bought their houses or other things with those Swiss loans …
I hate to think how things are in the lee developed parts of Hungary.
Still we like living here, people are very friendly …
BTW:
My wife just got that letter from Orbán today – she wanted to throw it into the trash immediately, but I persuaded her to answer those questions. I’m sure Orbán won’t like those answers…
@The Frog,
“BTW. I did predict that I could change your attitude simply by scratching the surface and revealing the ‘real’ you!”
It’s nice to know that a perfect stranger ‘knows’ me better than I do myself.
Now, back to teachers wages….it’s criminal.
I have said before, they should be paid 3X’s min what they are getting right now.
I personally have the utmost respect for the teaching profession. Always have and always will.
Badly performed write my essay knowledge could fail your academic success. Though, if you buy papers online of superb quality, all will be great.
I want that unemployment ratio should be decreased here to those people who are jobless right now like Peter Erd.He should get rid off it.
Monty phyton’s team would have a field day
seeing all these comments here.
Life of Brian Part 2 is in the making….
Plase give me a Biblical reference, where the bible
states that Jesus had jewish ethnic background. You
can’t find it!
Who cares – in which strange place do you live where this question is relevant ?
You can’t give any quote reference from the New
Testament about Jesus’ jewish ethnicity
http://www.jcu.edu/bible/humor/jesus.htm
Take your pick.