They are sooo sure of victory :-)

Big Jim seems very afraid ...

"A Fidesz MSZP coalition" - Holy smoke!

@wolfithenumbnuts
Erm. No genius. A Fidesz-MSZP coalition for 2010 is the surest way of guaranteeing a Jobbik win in 2014.

Can I ask what qualifications you think you have for commenting oin Hungarian affairs, when ALL your comments are run through with this sort of basic and total ignorance of any of the realities of Hungarian politics?

Or is that you think that any European demonstartion of Nationalism is automatically proto-Fascism, and must be suppressed before it turns into Nazism? And if so, what are your qualifications for thinking this, I mean, other than your Father being in the SS-Totenkopfverbände?

A Fidesz-MSZP coalition for 2010 is the surest way of guaranteeing a Jobbik win in 2014
bobscountrybunker at March 10, 2010 2:48 PM
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Why even bother with having an election, just ask 'bob'
Do you really think:
a) Jobbik will be alone subscribing on the position "most extreme party in Hungary" in 2014?
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b) Gábor Zázrivecz (aka Vona) will still be the Glorius Leader, as today
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No, according to the Spanish Neo-Nazi Zázrivecz promised 30% in this election and if Jobbik is seen to have done a worse election than the EP-election (could not really break through the glass-ceiling of 500.000 physical voters), then there will be plenty challengers to the crown
.
If you thing the SZDSZ-charade was both funny and embarrassing, just wait for the real clowns to make their way to the stage
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But, we all just have to sit down and wait for the outcome
The best thing would still be that we get a 4 party Parliament, most likely with the MDF
That would make it easier to build bridges in the next Parliament, because what Hungary need no more is more divisions

"Why even bother with having an election"
It's called democracy, dummy. Glad to see you finally admitting the contempt you have for it. You don't think the Hungarian people should be strusted with deciding their own future, do you?

"No, according to the Spanish Neo-Nazi Zázrivecz"
You are such a funny guy, I hope you take yourself seriously, because with statements like these, I can assure you, no-one, but no-one else does. Well, no-one with two brain cells to rub together...

And now the main point of the jobo programme:

"we shall inaugurate a Trianon Museum."

What'S THe full quotation incontinentpuppy? Hmm? Do you know how obvious you make your crude little hatchet job when everyone can see, quite clearly, you just don't have the balls to cite entire sentences. Let's look at the whole sentence, shall we? @ page 23
http://jobbik.com/temp/Jobbik-RADICALCHANGE2010.pdf
"And so that no one should ever attempt to have us forget the tragedy which befell our nation, we shall inaugurate a Trianon Museum."

Modern Hungary is 28.5% the size of Greater Hungary. Are you suggesting that if, in 1989, the US had been forced, by international diktat, to decrease in size from it's current 50 states to no more than the size of Alaska, California and Texas combined there wouldn't be some sort of massive memorial?

You have excelled yourself in being a pratt.

But your behaviour and selective quotation has amply proven Jobbik's point about people "attempting to have us forget that tragedy"!!!

1920 not 1989.

"Greater Hungary" "Greater Serbia "Greater Russia" "Großdeutschland"

These words remind me of something ...

"Greater Hungary" "Greater Serbia "Greater Russia" "Großdeutschland"
These words remind me of something ...
wolfi at March 10, 2010 4:56 PM
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What do they remind you of exactly? Someone not addressing the point of the US being decreased in size to Alaska, California and Texas? And how a people might udnerstandably react to something like that happening in their history?

Does it remind you of a little coward, who flits from blog post to blog post, making comments that bear no relationship whatsoever, to resoned argument, the discussions at hand (Night of the Long Knives!!!), or Hungarian realities. A person who never answers any question whatsoever about their positively deranged arguments?

The ramblings of a confused loser with a Nazi obsession, a hard-on for gay rights, and about as much intelligence as a slice of half-cooked leberkäse?

Someone who would do anything, anything, to escape the necessity of addressing the actual realities at hand?
Is that what it reminds you of?

This one is too good
The 2nd one today
'bob' must be getting stressed?
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1st 'bob' makes a crude cut out of context from my post:
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"Why even bother with having an election"
It's called democracy, dummy. Glad to see you finally admitting the contempt you have for it. You don't think the Hungarian people should be strusted with deciding their own future, do you?
bobscountrybunker at March 10, 2010 4:16 PM
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Then next post by 'bob', it complains about the same method it used against myself:
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"we shall inaugurate a Trianon Museum."
wolfi at March 10, 2010 4:26 PM

What'S THe full quotation incontinentpuppy? Hmm? Do you know how obvious you make your crude little hatchet job when everyone can see, quite clearly, you just don't have the balls to cite entire sentences. Let's look at the whole sentence, shall we?
...
But your behaviour and selective quotation has amply proven Jobbik's point about people "attempting to have us forget that tragedy"!!!
bobscountrybunker at March 10, 2010 4:50 PM
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Will 'bob's "behaviour and selective quotation" "have us forget" 'bob'?
Or we will always remember that pain from falling of the chair laughing?
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To answer 'bob' I just quote THE WHOLE SENTENCE:
"Why even bother with having an election, just ask 'bob'"
Viking at March 10, 2010 3:35 PM
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It was a comment on 'bob' already proclaiming the outcome of the 2014 years election, but 'bob' is getting a bit stressed with all these posts obviously, so I forgive it, as I am nice to animals

BOBS@ Beautifully explained but I feel you know you are really wasting your time with his type!

Next topic:
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"No, according to the Spanish Neo-Nazi Zázrivecz"
You are such a funny guy
bobscountrybunker at March 10, 2010 4:16 PM
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Well, that sentence should be read like:
'No, according to the Spanish Neo-Nazis, Zázrivecz...'
My fault!
I have though discussed this earlier on this web-site:
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http://www.democracianacional.org/dn/modules.php?name=News&file=print&sid=2794
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Run it through translate google com and you will find some cookies:
Speech by The Chairman of Jobbik, Gabor Vona,
...
we are prepared for the outlawing of Jobbik, we will continue the fight in very different ways and inexorably the next election will draw more than 30% of the vote. Our progress will be unstoppable and will impose a nationalist government
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'will impose a nationalist government'
sounds very democratic

Modern Hungary is 28.5% the size of Greater Hungary
bobscountrybunker at March 10, 2010 4:50 PM
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1) Today's Sweden is (I do not know actually, then we never studied that in school) not so many % of the Greater Sweden that covered:
* Today's Norway
* Today's Finland
* Part of today's Russia
* Today's Baltic States
* Northern part of today's Poland
Because off all ongoing wars it is hard to say exactly where the borders were sometimes, but Greater Sweden was the big regional power in Northern Europe about 100 years
All because to some Mines and fast moving small military forces (see the similarity to Hungary?)
We even have Swedish-speaking old people still alive in today's Ukraine that Stalin forced-moved there from some Baltic Islands
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2) For some reason you will not see any real monuments over this period, maybe because it ended in catastrophe when we had created the biggest threat to Europe, the Russian Empire with Peter The Great, who early got whipped by the Swedish King, but learnt to master the technique of manoeuvring troops fast and together with a bigger force (in the end) he could finish Greater Sweden
Since then, and maybe that is why Sweden does not celebrate this period, the focus of Swedish Foreign and Defence policies have been on protecting itself from the Russian Empire with a very pragmatic approach
Not always very glorious performed, but pragmatism seldom is, but it brings more bread on the table for the people
Today integration in the EU is important

The thing that continues to fuel Hungarian irredentism, and which makes the situation different from examples of territorial reduction by Germany and Sweden is the large number of Hungarians that were left in the neighboring states by the post WW1 and 2 boundary arrangments. In the case of Germany, most of the 13 million or so Germans east of the "Oder Neisse line" and in the Sudetenland, were given the "heave-ho" after WW2. Had they remained living under Polish and Czech control, I would guess that there would remain a vocal nationalist fringe in Germany demanding boundary revision.

Although the process of Euro integration will likely continue in the future, I don't see the issue of Trianon revision totally going away in Hungarian political life.

In the case of Germany, most of the 13 million or so Germans east of the "Oder Neisse line" and in the Sudetenland, were given the "heave-ho" after WW2. Had they remained living under Polish and Czech control, I would guess that there would remain a vocal nationalist fringe in Germany demanding boundary revision.

Although the process of Euro integration will likely continue in the future, I don't see the issue of Trianon revision totally going away in Hungarian political life.
Farkas László at March 10, 2010 8:52 PM
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That is IMHO a fair assessment, but I think it was a Good Thing(tm) that the ethnic Hungarians were not 'asked to leave' in 1920/45
I miss that dimension of the Trianon-debate
It could actually had been much worse
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Trianon revision may not be "totally going away in Hungarian political life", but it will probably be much concentrated to Budapest and the politicians
With proper integration, good cross-border trade and communications, the border will in many senses disappear
That, de facto, will be the end of Trianon
Pragmatism, not idealism, is our friend here
The aim is to reach practical results, not inflammatory rhetoric
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But no one is claiming it will be easy
The current Slovak situation is clear example on that
Cool heads on both sides are needed, as always
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Maybe Wolfie can give some input on the German exiles from Böhmen/Märhren/Preussia and their organisations today?
I remember I read about them in Germany in the 1970s, but after that?

Dear Viking,

Hungarian talk of Trianon revision is of course a rhetorical issue purely. Those who advocate it, of course are in no position to make it happen.

As usual, Farkas provides us with the correct summation...Trianon should not be forgotten, it has cut too deeply into the psyche of the Magyar nation. But the reality is, that barring some unforseen sci-fi invention by a nationalist Magyar scientist...we will probably not see any type of revision to national borders. Soooo, I'm putting my money on a super weapon that makes Magyars able to peacefully annex the 64 counties! That or alien intervention!

@Viking:

For us in the middle of Europe the borders are nonexistant - I almost don't realise when I'm passing from Germany to Austria or Hungary to Slovenia or ...

@perverse pavian:
"(Have I btw told you that you disgust me?)"

No, you surely don't disgust me, you make me laugh!

As far as i understand, not all part of the area lost at Trianon was actually hungarian? I thought quite big part was slavic? Discussion of this huge area lost (60 % or whatever) is not exactly correct in that case as i guess it cannot be sensible argued that Hungary should still own e.g. slavic areas?

However, in terms of hungarian speaking areas i understand the emotional issue, after all, there are other countries that are still struggling with the similar memories. Indeed i know the situation quite well in Finland, as it lost its "spritual heartland" to Soviet Union, including second biggest city and more than 10 % of the whole population lost their homes, belongings and significant amount of those who stayed there as well their lives under stalin.

The issue of Karelia has never fully died in Finland and there are people that would like to get it back, however, it has been mainly case of buying back, and i have understood that possibly Jeltsin even offered it in desperate need of money. However, in typical pragmatic finnish way, most people consider that it would be way too expensive even if they would get it back for free as the infra etc are so poor condition there. My understanding is that not even the finnish equivalent of Jobbik would like to waste the money in Karelia.

As far as i have understood the approach nowadays is to support cultural and environmental projects, not hoping to get it back.

Ile is absolutely right (first paragraph).

Hungary needs to adopt the strategy of Mexico...they are sending millions of their people into the US in a fifth column movement and will eventually vote themselves into power and then secede the SW from the rest of the country! That is how Mexico will regain their "lost" territories! Now, if we could only find millions of unemployed Hungarians! :)

Hungary needs to adopt the strategy of Mexico...they are sending millions of their people into the US in a fifth column movement and will eventually vote themselves into power and then secede the SW from the rest of the country! Attila at March 14, 2010 6:31 AM
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Well, we should not forget the hundreds of thousands of Mexicans became U.S. citizens overnight
Since that time, countless Chicanos and Chicanas have confronted discrimination, racism and exploitation
The Chicano Movement had been fomenting since the end of the US - Mexican War in 1848, when the current U.S-Mexican border took form
The Chicano Movement gained momentum after WWII when groups such as the American G.I. Forum (AGIF), which was formed by returning Mexican American veterans, joined in the efforts by other civil rights organizations
The AGIF first received national exposure when it took on the cause of Felix Longoria, a Mexican American serviceman who was denied funeral services in his home-town of Three Rivers, Texas after being killed during WWII
So, you could fight and die for the US, but not be having a decent funeral
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When will we see Jobbik support for the Mexican Trianon (Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo) where Mexico lost 55% of its pre-war territory from the Mexican-American War (1846–1848)?
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When will the Jobbik MEPs take up the Mexican 'Trianon' as a pre-condition for the EUs negotiations with the US on what-ever?
Supporting others = gain support for your own case