an honest, unbiased report on jobbik? unheard of!! if only you were running the country's media, the hungarian people might even hear the truth occasionally!

im not sure exactly what you were expecting to see. patriotic christians tend not to be the violent facists that your television will have you believe.

but be careful - honest observations in this country generally tend to make you a "Facist" a
"hungrist" or a "racist" etc. be prepared to be accused of marital infidelity if you continue to destabilise the regime like this!!!

Sorry to hear your favorite t-shirt was in the wash. WakkaWakkaWakka

@ Paul,

You forgot to add mu magyar :)

Maybe if Hitler was around today, he could help jobbik with a few tips on how to make the event more exciting :)

if only you were running the country's media, the hungarian people might even hear the truth occasionally!
Paul at March 16, 2010 1:43 PM
---
Ell, I did not see these 'gentlemen' on National TV yesterday and obviously Erik missed them also from his window-view (Pictures 27, 30, 31 and my favourite number 38 (Gábor Zázrivecz (aka Vona) speaking with 2 'Gentlemen' as 'Honorary Guards' in front of him))
No uniform fetishism here...
-
http://www.hunhir.hu/magazin.php?pid=keptar&oid=ut&id=000162
-
HunHir's slogan is the Premium/Leading Radical Portal (in Hungary) (in my bad translation), so they must be trusted as being unbiased of course

WHAT IS THE DEAL WITH THE SUPER-GAY UNIFORMS??? I wonder how much they charge for the \"2 men + 1 cup\" action?
-------
I thought Jobbik was Anti-Gay??? The people in vikings pictures look Gayer than Gay!...
Ooh those strong men are so tough and sexy guarding vona!!!! Whats in those black pouches? Theres a feather in your caps jobbik!

Some prefer pictures of war criminal, mű-israeli IDF soldiers target shooting Palestinian mothers and their children or some photos of same heroic IDF soldiers forcing 8 year old Palestinian children to open suspicious packages for them.
Nothing compares with photos of those heroic mű-israelis in action.

A freak who calls himself ‘Jackson’ saw fit to invent this filthy smear of Hungarians:

‘I have seen more prostitutes, thugs, gang members, looting, fighting and public sex in Hungary than I would see in the USA if I lived another 1000 years. The pathetic pace of the nation urges me to gag just thinking about it.’

Farkas László was quick to endorse him:

‘I take your comments as a sort of critical "reality check", and as such I appreciate them. Had you posted this on politics.hu, I could just envision the defensive critical responses that would be directed at you for saying it. Many people don't take such criticisms well, prefering to retreat into a heroic self image.’

http://www.pestiside.hu/20100309/statueatory-rape-crisis-continues-as-beloved-village-madonna-pinched/

Your ‘love’ of Hungary and Hungarians is showing, Laci! You lying little shit.

Erik the crowd spread all the way upto the Godor Klub it was huge way more then 10 thousand, for christs sakes your apartment only had the side view of the stage, http://barikad.hu/node/49088

50 thousand people, i ws there

@Elle
It comes as a big surprise and disappointment. Are you sure that it is Farkas Laszlo?

@ BIG JIM

Well, there he is, on the link I provided. The writing style is unmistakeable.

@ justasking

I need not be reminded that you are not responsible for what other people write around here.

Just keep in mind Elle's posting regarding Farkas Laszlo as you are sipping your glass of wine with her toasting JOBBIK. In my mind, she is the perfect representative of the party.

Her posting re FL made my day - Sorry FL but the posting confirmed what I already knew.

BTW, this is as good a time as any to let you know that on this website, you are the only Hungarian who makes me feel proud of my heritage.

Loving me will have to be like loving Hungary- take the good along with the bad (or at least the part you don't agree with!)

Her posting re FL made my day
olga at March 16, 2010 7:05 PM
---
Olga,
I think it is 'elle's aristocratic background that make her feel that she 'owns' Hungary, so every one not stating that the past, present and future Hungary was/is/will be just that Hollywood wonderful, she will have a problem with
.
Reality is just an Illusion
Propaganda is Reality
.
Reminds about the old Soviet-union actually
I suppose the stripes never wear out

So a long time visitor to Budapest notes that things have gone downhill over the years, that public services are inefficient and that he sees too much signs of crime- well what's wrong with saying that? That's not incompatible with what the Jobbik view of what went wrong in the past is it? Hopefully these are things Jobbik will correct if it gains the political mandate it needs to do so.

I don't take these kinds of criticisms as if they were personal attacks for one thing. I also don't take them necessarily as Hungarian hatred. It makes many of us sad to see the "haza" mismanaged, and there I( believe many Jobbik supporters agree.

So what if somebody thinks things have sucked; what about the future?

Olga. You should be proud of your Hungarian heritage irrespective of any other consideration -
including Farkas Laszlo!
Mr Farkas (Wolf) is a personal favorite of mine and I find his postings interesting,and diverse,
and reassuring.
He is also fond of many of the things I like too, including old films etc.
A very good human being and person many would do well to emulate.
I know this might sound a bit "gushing" but it is true nevertheless.

Erik."Maybe next time they should try to make it a bit more threatening."?
OK. Why didn't you try this: "wade into the crowd
wearing a T-shirt saying "Kiss me I'm a gay Jewish foreigner,"
I'm sure you would have got your kiss - right between the eyes at the top of your "hooked" nose.
Szebb jovott or something....
Morvai does not seem to draw breath when she speaks
and strangely enough appears to be asthmatic?
I asked Vándorló about this but he didn't comment?

Hello all,

"Jackson" on pestiside.hu, around whom this "controversy" swirls, just posted on how Hungary should not be in the EU. He says he is an American Hungarian, but almost everything he says is very compatible with Jobbik positions. Before anyone should accuse me or him of "Hungarian hatred", let me say that I have heard criticisms of Hungary and it's situation stated far more forcefully, and in Hungarian, by Hungarians; many of whom are Jobbik.

Prostitution and porn production is very widespread in the former communist block nations. This I attribute mostly to the lack of economic opportunities along with the inperfect or unsuccessful transition from communism to a more full employment situation and market economy. After 1989, the region went back to it's traditionally number 1 export: people.

Dear advocate,

That was very kind, thank you.

FarkasLaszlo@ You are really dissappointing today! Any Jobbik supporter would know that Hungary still as its own bank notes in its own language with national heroes etc.. Any Jobbik supporter would also know Hungary produces little if any coal these days--you were taken in by one hate filled sad American.
In my opinion he was probably one of these naive tourists ripped off in a bar,believing all the girls really thought him attractive until they took is increasingly worthless Dollars!!

It seems that Farkas Lászlo abandoned his (excellent) pose as a well-meaning old codger when Hungary of 15 March 2010 made a massive show of its endorsement of JOBBIK. That was altogether too much for him. He ‘came out’ as the nasty little commie bastard he actually is. What ‘pofa’ it takes to compose an obscene description of Hungary, posit it as the reality there, then declare that this is also the view of JOBBIK. For anyone who has not seen his exchange with ‘Jackson’ (who reads like the ‘Bystander’ with whom he had a long conversation on this blog), have a look at it here:

http://www.pestiside.hu/20100309/statueatory-rape-crisis-continues-as-beloved-village-madonna-pinched/

But this is all good. It shows that the enemy within is desperate. And it appears that the Hungarian posters on this site have been shocked into silence. Certainly, I no longer have the stomach to come here. The ‘controversy’ Farkas Mosi says is ‘raging’ around himself and his friend will have to continue to rage among their own kind.

Kedves Ricsi,

You give me more benefit of a doubt than the other person, and I appreciate that. I think "Jackson" is a bit tongue in cheek, forceful and definitely upset and disappointed, and one can disagree with him in some particulars, but believe me, I've heard worse from Hungarians in real life, as I'm sure you have too.

I'm not saying he is a Jobbik supporter (he'll have to answer that one himself), but like many other Hungarians as well as Jobbik supporters, he is not happy with what he sees and what has been going on. The harm lies not in saying there are problems, but in the problems themselves.

Dear Elle,

You once asked me if I thought you were an "Úri nő". Recall my answer.

I have never, and never will call someone else around here a "lying little shit". Many people feel that they can insult others around here just because they disagree with them, but I do not do that.

As to: "He ‘came out’ as the nasty little commie bastard he actually is. ", that I leave to the judgement of this community. I hope some will recall my contribution to the 1956 rememberance last Oct.

I wish Jobbik and any other political group all the best in cleaning up the economy,the condition of Budapest, in reducing crime and prostitution, reducing bureaucratic inefficiency and in creating a Hungary that makes a better impression on both Hungarians and visitors alike. Constructive efforts along these lines deserve our support.

@Advocate

Completely agree with your posting.

As always, I continue to be proud of being Hungarian. Until I found this website, no one has ever questioned that nor has anyone asked me to justify my feelings. So nothing has changed about my self perception.

To me , FL represents everything that's good and noble about Hungary and Hungarians

The "foreigners" living in Hungary simply represent the Western ideals I was brought up with who gave me insight into a Hungary that I was not aware of. They are the kind of people I "hang out" with

Just like FL represents "good" Elle represents "bad" Her postings clearly show alack of tolerance, lack of understanding of other people's opinions and from today's postings, it appears she needs some anger management skills.

I hope she gets the help she needs because today's attack on FL are the symptoms of something much more sinister than just holding JOBBIK political beliefs.

Don't worry FL, there are at least a few of us who actually take the time to read your posts properly to see where you're coming from. Rest assured, I've never thought of you as 'commie bastard', you have too much style (and grace) for that.
-
On the other hand, I find it really interesting that Jackson was actually agreeing with much of the far-right policy rhetoric, but that this went unnoticed in preference for the view that he was attacking Hungary.
-
By the way, while I agreed with what you said about cleaning up the country, there was one thing I would add. When you're rounding up the 'whores' to put them in jail, you should also be rounding up all the men who buy their services as well. It takes two to tango. It should also be noted that most women who turn to prostitution do so because of desperation...and especially in former communist countries, there is a big trade for human trafficking into the sex industry.
-
Here is a quote for you from Anthony Giddens's book "Studies in Social and Political Theory" p253. I hope you like it.
"An individual can only be free if he (or she) is an autonomous actor, capable of mastering and of realising his (or her) impulses. The distinctions between 'anomie', and 'egoism' and 'individualism' are thus of key importance."

I was not the least bit surprised by some of the reaction, I've seen such attacks against people who are critical of what is or has been going on in Hungary.

Again, so what if someone has noticed that Budapest has too many whores and too much crime? That someone thinks negatively of what they have seen should be the least of our problems! Agreeing with that does not make me a communist.

I think there has been a bit of overeaction here.

Yes, of course you're right FL, but you made the 'mistake' of not 'clarifying' that the offenders come from one or another minority group. For example, on another thread was this quote: "...subsistence crime, otherwise known as Gypsy crime."
-
It's probably a good thing Morvai doesn't post here, because I'm sure she would get in trouble for suggesting that the majority of assaults against women happen at the hands of their intimate partners and that Hungarian men use 'culture' as an excuse to be misogynistic bastards. ...or even that a significant number of assaults against men are perpetrated by personal acquaintances such as drinking partners.

FL, here is a link to the thread I posted earlier on regarding the Morvai article I just referred to:
http://www.politics.hu/20100305/poll-reveals-jobbik-scores-better-among-young-people-than-socialists#c21

@ Olga;

There were a couple three things, that I read today on Politics, that had me sitting back and shaking my head: 1) You saying to Paul "thanks for not attacking me" and 2) admitting to Laci how he alone makes you fell proud of you heritage.

God forbid if we were to treat each other not specially...but decently.
--------------------------------------------------

After watching all three main party speeches both on the TV and the net, I found Viktor's to be the most motivating.

Pity though, the puppet masters that pull MSZP's strings, also pull Fidesz's

@ justasking

Re: "admitting to Laci how he alone makes you feel proud of you heritage." - I meant on this website - a Hungarian who lives in Hungary and can be found on this website. Hope that was clear.

There are lot others whose postings I read and respect but I am not sure of their nationality or where they live - today's example : "Advocate"

"Proud Hungarian" is not the phrase that comes to my mind when I read postings by Hungarian residents like Pavaszem, Ricsi, or Elle who btw has serious issues that only Law could relate to. Maybe they could sign up for "2 for the price of 1 anger management courses."

I actually read the posting that caused all the fuss by "Jackson" He seems like a very unpleasant person , critical with gratuitous comments. (He sounds like an American Republican with "Christian Values". The type of person I would avoid like the plague or the MG)

I thought you'd be shocked and dismayed at Elle's becoming totally unhinged and calling FL names including " a nasty little commie bastard"

You must admit that except for FL and Cinaed (who of course doesn't count because no Hungarian blood flows through those veins) there are not too many people around here who can be described as "patient" and "polite". Just because I lack those qualities does not mean I don't admire them

Olga: "no Hungarian blood flows through those veins"
You're right there...apparently all that flows through my veins is caffeine and pure evil. mwahahaha.

@Cináed:

You made a very important observation in one of your comments about those East European women having to work as prostitutes in Western Europe.

Though I haven't had any personal contacts there (I have a very good wife, as you know), I've heard horrible stories about that traffic in bodies.

Did you know that the latest craze in Germany is the "flat rate whorehouse" or "all you can f*ck" for 100 € ?

Yes, in the age of Viagra that's a viable thing for some guys ...

Dear Zsuzsa and Olga,

I have to say I'm somewhat embarassed. It's a compliment of course. The nation has seen so many bad things and the people had to endure so much. I remember well the "real" communism, (as opposed to the rhetorical one that a person gets accused of around here when someone disagrees with them.)

The disagreements around here are a sign that people are free to think and express themselves as individuals, something that was not allowed under the soviet system. What we do with this freedom is the measure of ourselves, not just as individuals, but as a nation and people as well.

Wolfi: ...and this is part of my point. While we so readily demonise the women who become involved in prostitution, we convenienently forget where the majority of the money that fuels the sex industry comes from. That is, mainly married, middle-aged (and up) men from affluent mainstream backgrounds. It is particularly bad in countries that have such a patronising attitude to women.To quote Morvai again:
"At a meeting on law reform ideas, a couple of academics suggested that all women should have an enforceable right to be sexually harassed at work at least once a year. At a conference dinner, some of the participating judges suggested that all wives should have an enforceable right to be raped by their husbands at least once a month."
-...and to counter the argument that this is a 'learned' behaviour from the west, she says: "I told them on all three occasions that there are several countries in the world where people in their position could find themselves in big trouble for making such statements. Moreover, I told them these are the countries that we (Hungary) want to join as part of the E.U. [...]These are the countries we identify as Europe or as Western civilization.Indeed, it appears that what 'they' call sexual harassment, 'we' call fun. What they call marital rape, we call marriage. This is 'our culture'. It seems that 'culture' is something the law cannot and should not attempt to comprehend."
-perhaps we need to rethink what the term 'good Christian values' means.

I respect FL but I can see Elle's point, once you are aware of how sinister the establishment operates there is no more grey area to contemplate, it's very clear as day. The only disappointment I find with FL is that he hasn’t displayed his wisdom when he is confronted by establishment people, Jesus demonstrated and refused to baptize the Pharisees because they would have misqualified the use of the Holy spirit.

Jesus also freely associated with the rejects of society, had a tax collector as a disciple, told the parable of the 'good Samaritan', and had a close personal friendship with a woman many believe was a prostitute. ...and in the parable of the sheep and the goats (Matthew 25:40) says "The King will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'"

Zsuzsa: "God forbid if we were to treat each other not specially...but decently."
-
...and therein lies the greatest challenge humanity will ever face.
-
Hope things are going well for you.
Take it easy.
C.

Cinaed you just displayed how igorant you are.

...well, I did tell you, "just caffeine and pure evil."
-
Hope you're well Law.

Yes ok thanks mate, cheers :)

Well, there he is, on the link I provided. The writing style is unmistakeable.
Elle at March 16, 2010 6:45 PM

Sadly, I have to agree with you.

By the way Cinaed there is a difference between who Jesus helped to enlighten, the willfully ignorant and the innocently ignorant and the Pharisees were in the first group the willfully ignorant, I hope this answers your curiosity.

@ FL and Cinaed

FL : " I remember well the "real" communism, (as opposed to the rhetorical one that a person gets accused of around here when someone disagrees with them." - That is the "truth" in one pithy sentence.

Now try telling the Members of the Flat Earth Society that the earth is round - good luck.

@ Cinaed - not to worry . Caffeine and Evil are good. I have both, plus Hungarian Blood in those veins. I have been blessed

About Prostitution - some people feel it exploits women, others feel it's a woman's right to sell her body. I would like to see women debate the subject as opposed to men. It would also be nice for women to "choose" such a life as opposed to be forced into it

BTW, I am thankful to Law that Jesus teachings are interpreted for me. Knowing that I may be "willfully ignorant" gives me more control over my life. It's a sunny day in Toronto and such good news bodes well for the rest of my day.

So how about them elections coming up?

@ Olga;

I believe I said that there were a " couple, three things that had me sitting back and shaking my head"

Look, when I read what this Jackson character wrote, I immediately thought "f*ck you buddy" and yes if he would have posted this on Politics I would have been all over him like Oprah on a ham.

I also believe that we should not be attacking our own, meaning fellow Hungarians. The "bekepzelt kulfoldi" on this site, are free game as far as I am concerned.

I have said some pretty critical stuff about Hungary myself...but the difference is, I say it out of frustration, at times anger AND only to Hungarians and not non-Hungarians.

@ justasking

I agree with you - as I was reading his posting Rush Limbaugh came to mind.

However, FL does have the right to answer him any way he wishes.

So to my mind, the venom unleashed by Elle had very little do do with FL - I honestly think it gave a glimpse into her mental state. Emotionally healthy people do not react the way she did. It is not about politics or Hungary.

If she could not control her rage with FL's opinions, I would not hesitate to make the judgement call she really needs help. I am just on the verge of feeling sorry for her - maybe by this afternoon I am working on it

Hi Olga: What I would do for a sunny day.We've had a week of damp cool weather with a temperature inversion above so the pollution of 7+ million people is trapped near street level.Sometimes I really miss the wide open spaces.
-
I agree that women should talk about women's issues, but for my part, there isn't a whole lot I can do to change.Besides, I think one of the really big problems with women's rights has been that it HAS primarily been seen as a women's issue only.Until men realise that 'women hold up 50% of the sky'(probably more, I know plenty of lazy men) there will always be a glass ceiling. Sorry...to mix metaphors.I do think what a person does with their own body is their own choice, although while 'everything is permissable, not everything is beneficial'.I do also think that there are responsibilities that we all have to each other to be as healthy (mentally and physically)as we can be.
-
to elections...I got bored with the same revolving door conversation.The discussion of prostitution is relevent to the elections because of a)the 'Hungarian morality' debate, b)the minority/'Tiszta Magyar debate, c)Morvai's academic/political pedigree, d) the relationship that posters here have to do with all of the above.I think with all the talk on the really 'visible' issues, perhaps we should also be talking about some of the 'hidden' ones too.For me,one of the most important measures of a culture is how it treats its women...something every culture could improve on.

@ Olga;

I never said that people can't post what they want, hell's bell's I do.

As for suggesting that somebody needs help, is not right and uncalled for. Besides, I'm sure that a shit load of people here think I do. So what.

Hi All,

I still say it's a tempest in a teacup, and it is getting blown out of proportion.

I want to hear people's impressions, especially of Budapest, (a city I care very much about) whether good or bad. To hear the bad lets me see what it is that can possibly be improved. I've heard a number of people express the frustration that "jackson" expressed, especially those who have known the city over time. I don't consider them "Hungarian haters", just frustrated to see things turning for the worse.

What makes me different than some, is that I am not disturbed by negative feedback about what they see in Hungary. I don't take it as a personal attack, my ego can withstand a negative review of someone's experince of Budapest! What "Jackson" is testifying to is public mismanagement by the people and parties in power for at least the last 15 years. On a positive note, let's see about changing things for the better.

Dear Law,

I took Jackson's critique as a reflection on the ruling establishment of the past and it's handling of crime and public services. If he is American as he says, he sounds like a right wing one. I just don't see him as "Hungarian establishment", or at least not the one connnected to the Socailists and ex-commies who have ruled in the past. If he was part of that group, what political advantage would there be to him saying such things, especially when we are going into an election? His post makes me yearn for change and a different leadership/party in power.

"On a positive note, let's see about changing things for the better."

I have a few suggestions of my own. Start by putting Jackson on a list of undesirable aliens and banning all non-resident vagrants. No begging or soliciting and heavy fines for littering.
Confiscate all the properties belonging to Demsky, Hagyo, and Gyurcsany et al. and use it to build and maintain livable shelters for those who lost their jobs.

lopott holmi vissza jár

Dear Big Jim,

Those of course would be government decisions, and would have to come from a different ruling group than what we had in the past. Let's clean up Budapest, in order to make it a better place to live and visit. Doing that would be mostly a policing and prosecuting issue.

The rest of the country needs more crimefighting as well. It also needs an economic jumpstart.

FL: If we never hear negative feedback, we never learn. Recognition of problems is the first step to fixing them...nothing new there.
-
What I found about Budapest is that parts of it are stunningly beautiful, while right around the corner, some parts are dirty, neglected and ramshackle. Some neighbourhoods are dark and scary, while some are middle/upper suburban neighbourhoods comparable to any city in the world. I do know that Budapest has a thriving porn/sex industry, and more than once had the pleasure of having to jump over vomit or urine on the footpath.
-
I have to say though, I never felt really threatened...One night we got lost in an unfamiliar district (on foot) we had to walk through an area full of skaters and other 'scary teenagers'.They didn't bother us at all. (we weren't with any police 'colleagues')
I was really sad to read Jackson's account of porn in Heroes Square...though I believe the police didn't intervene.It's no surprise considering the things that go on in police schools. Heroes Square is such a beautiful and solemn place and I can understand his outrage.If this happened in Au, I would WANT people to be outraged and for it to not go away unnoticed.I would want something done...not attack the person who reported it. Shooting the messenger is bad form.

Hi Cinead,

I anticipated the potential reaction when I responded to Jackson. He won't be the last person who comes away with bad impressions if things don't change.

The crime problem isn't just about street punks, but gangsters and organised crime. Dealing with punks is easy, because they have little money and connections. Dealing with organised crime types is much harder, because they can bribe the police and public officials. (That's probably why the porn filming could go ahead in a public plaza.)

"As I love cooking, I have always admired British chef and restaranteur Gordon Ramsey, featured on several shows on the BBC. He is possibly the world's most successful fine dining restaurant owner and is a billionaire. When his staff collect the comment cards filled out by customers and read them to him, he gets quite mad when favorable ones are presented to him. He is not interested in compliments, but criticisms! As he is pursueing perfection and excellence, he realises that you can't do that by immersing yourself in flattery and self delusion, but rather need to consider what can be better or improved. Ramsey is a fierce and tough Scotsman, and his attitude is one that Magyars should be inspired by when considering how to make their country better. Denial and an over inflated sense of self worth and pride are harmful not just in the restaurant business, but in the running of a country as well."

"Certainly, I no longer have the stomach to come here." (Elle)
-
Does that mean your 'tenure' is about to end?
-
damn, the caffeine is slipping, the pure evil is reasserting itself.

Glad to see our more rabid keyboard bashers have taken the time to calm down and (kind of) apologise to FL for comments like this:

"Your ‘love’ of Hungary and Hungarians is showing, Laci! You lying little shit."

Those of us who visit this site who do actually live here in Hungary, those of us who pay taxes, who work here, who raise our families here, those of us who actually want to change the country for the better without resorting the smashing each other over the head respect the calmness, clarity and general common sense and decency that Mr.Farkas so often demonstrates on these comment threads.

I think those who resort to kneejerk reflexive attacks on anyone who dares to not sing from the exact same page as them, especially some of our esteemed trans-Atlantic visitors, should calm the f**k down. You are constantly at volume 10, when maybe a slightly more delicate 4 is more appropriate.

Thank you László for the ideas, balanced exchanges and genuine dialogue you so often generate. Keep up the good work!

I wish I could understand why a desire to improve Hungary and get rid of corruption (as Jobbik wants) must always be linked to the kind of bile and hatred we seem to hear from the Jobbik supporters on this site. If they had supporters who could speak reasonably and calmly, not spit in everyone else\'s eyes and steer clear of the racism, it would really help their cause, but it seems like the nasty-ness count is a 100%. Why can\'t there be a party similar to Jobbik that renounces the ugly personality defects and xenophobia? They might actually be popular!!! From what we hear from the Jobbik supporters on this site, though, the two seem to be mutually exclusive... why IS that?

FL: the other day I was reading a comparative report on crime in a variety of EU countries of which Hungary was included.The upshot of it was that although public perceptions of visible crime were high, actual rates were relatively low...however, when asked if they had asked are been asked to bribe a police officer, many answered they had.(The Burden of Crime in the EU, Research Report: A Comparative Analysis of the European Crime and Safety Survey (EU ICS) 2005)
-
After having worked with the Rendorseg, I know that corruption is a very normal part of daily life from the lowest to the highest...the only difference is that the higher in the system you go, the higher the dollar values and stakes that are involved. It's my opinion that if people think the political system hasn't changed much since the communist era, the police force has changed even less.It's the same people running the show, the same organisational structure. Many of the cops I worked with keep their badges and insignia from the 'old days' on display in their offices and their old uniforms in the closet.After one incident involving a situation in which immigration would not give the police information, my boss cursed under his breath 'there was a day they would have answered to US', in a very menacing tone.
-
The recruits I worked with were nice young kids, many of whom were from provincial towns and villages. When I think about what they're headed towards I try not to wonder what they'll be like in a few years

@ Farkas Laszlo,)))
You jewloving commie mossad agent,
like I told you when you fell into the trap set by justbitching:
YOU ARE EITHER WITH US OR YOU ARE AGAINST US!
Forget all the jews, like zukor!
Your father was right!
You are a pussy!
Bernie

@ all

I promise not to comment on the Jackson posting any more. This will be the last - he is really not worth it.

My favourite sentence from his diatribe was "his deep love for his heritage". I would hate to see what he would have written if his "deep love" was
less evident

Back to Holocaust Denial - People like Elle are screaming about "free speech" - Free speech is what this idiot Jackson wrote when he expressed hateful and hurtful comments about Hungary and Hungarians in general. How is this going to "incite hatred" against Hungarians living within Hungary or anywhere else in the world? It isn't. Minor legal details that Hungarians are not even a minority.

It's "free speech" to deny the extermination of close to 11 million people,while inciting hatred against Jews world wide and denying the death of 5 million non-Jews. Yet it's not Free Speech for Farkas Laszlo to have an opinion expressed without being attacked.

This is not about FL - I continue to be amazed at the amount of vitriol spewed around here and the clear evidence of utter hypocricy.

Defenders of free speech? What a joke

How about a JOBBIK definition of Free Speech? KM should be able to draft a law that clearly defines it as a Constitutional Right provided it does not offend any Neo-Nazi within the pre-Trianon Borders of Hungary" - that ought to make a lot of people on this website weep with joy

Cinaed - you are making me laugh again. What's in that coffee and is it legal? (4.22 p.m. posting)

@ Olga;

Huh?

A lunatic, ‘Jackson’, came up with an obscenely lurid fantasy about Hungary’s being slightly more evil than Sodom and Gomorra. FL fell upon it with glee. (See http://www.pestiside.hu/20100309/statueatory-rape-crisis-continues-as-beloved-village-madonna-pinched/). He has since been explaining his desire to take the lunatic’s ranting as a ‘reality check’, positing that he is so far above ordinary mortals that he does not take ‘criticism’ of Hungary personally. I wonder how FL will handle the information that crime rate in Hungary is among the lowest in the EU?

Those of you who are not inclined to grab unlikely chances to malign Hungary should take a look at these EU Commission statistics: http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/cache/ITY_OFFPUB/KS-SF-09-036/EN/KS-SF-09-036-EN.PDF. You will see here that Britain has the worst violent crime record in Europe, sometimes exceeded by Ireland, and followed by Estonia, Holland and Denmark. Risk of being assaulted or threatened is greatest in the UK, Ireland, the Netherlands, Belgium, Sweden and Denmark, and least in Italy, Portugal, Hungary, Spain and France. (Cont.)

(Cont.) An earlier (2005) survey: http://www.europeansafetyobservatory.eu/downloads/EUICS_The%20Burden%20of%20Crime%20in%20the%20EU.pdf, shows that sexual violence against women is most frequent in Ireland, Sweden, and Germany Austria, and least frequent in Hungary. Hate crime against minorities is most frequent in France, Denmark, the UK and the Benelux countries. Car crime is the lowest in Hungary, Germany and Austria, and theft from cars is lowest in Hungary, Greece, Germany, Denmark and Finland. Drug problems are lowest in Hungary and Finland. The Report ends thus: ‘Trend data on Hungary are not available. The level of over all crime is far below the EU average: Hungary is a low crime country. This is especially true for the prevalence of drugs-related problems and hate crimes’.

So, FL, how about a genuine reality check?

@elle:

Thanks a lot - I always knew that I made the right decision coming to Hungary and getting a Hungarian wife ...

PS: I really enjoy living here near Héviz - now that spring is arriving ...

Yeah Wolfie, your such a catch.

Oh, now this is funny! FL is encouraging the lunatic ‘Jackson’ to think that it has uttered a constructive criticism of Hungary, and encouraging it also to think that it might have thoughts on ‘how the country might be turned around’. Perhaps FL is Jackson. I quote FL:
Dear Jackson,
Without perhaps intending to, you have caused a stir on the sister website politics.hu, where I have had to make numerous posts explaining myself in relation to what you originally said. As I have predicted in my original response to you, it was a possibility that I entirely foresaw, as I have been posting there long enough to know.
You can't escape the flak by just confining your posts to pestiside.hu. Before you consider posting further about how Hungary can be turned around, you have to address the concerns that some have about being a "hater" of Hungary and being a "commie" sympathiser, and you will have to do that on politics,hu, where people already know about you. I'm not one to tell another what to do around here, but I am warning you that any criticism of the nation will not be taken well by some and will be met with a lot of insult.
http://www.pestiside.hu/20100309/statueatory-rape-crisis-continues-as-beloved-village-madonna-pinched/

@Elle: You seem to be arguing against yourself here. One minute you are all going on about the epidemic of violent crime, now you are describing a peaceful panacea.
Overall Hungary is not at all violent. But Jackson did not describe it as a violent country in his first post. He said it was corrupt and debased. The corruption is palpable and you could hardly argue against that. However, Italy, Spain, and plenty of other places have far worse corruption.
On the debased nature of the culture you only have to look at the video I linked to and see how the police look on indifferent.
Also, no-one reports crime here, because the police and authorities really don't give a shit.
Anyway, perhaps you would understand more if you actually ever came here or lived here.
p.s. How was your imaginary trip to Sopron?
p.p.s Having said all that, Jackson is obviously a complete dick.

Dear people,

We have been getting bent out of shape over the writings of a 16 year old, which is what "Jackson" admits to being!

I told you all it was getting blown out of proportion.

Below is my response to him. After reading it, I suggest we all cool it with this guy:

"Dear Jackson,

"Are you really 16? If so then I feel you have yet to gain the knowledge and experience and understanding of what you are dealing with around here. Being American Hungarian, I strongly appreciate your interest and concern for the land of your ancestors. I actually would like to encourage it."

"There are important cultural differences for you to process. Your tongue in cheek outspokeness is understandable coming from an American teenager. Americans are used to venting their discontent and criticism openly about everything. In the countries of eastern europe, people are terribly sensitive about finding fault with their societies when these criticisms come from a foreigner."

"I welcome your participation around here, but with a few conditions. I suggest you address your posts to me personally for one. Second, if you feel something doesn't seem right about your experiences in Hungary, ask me about it and put it in the form of a question, like "This is what I noticed, what's up with it?" Avoid making pointed judgements and tone down your rhetorical style."

(cont)

‘You seem to be arguing against yourself here. One minute you are all going on about the epidemic of violent crime, now you are describing a peaceful panacea.’

The epidemic of violent crime is in rural Hungary, perpetrated by Gypsies who are encouraged by your lot to think they are entitled to commit it. I don’t quite get ‘peaceful panacea’. A ‘panacea’ is a cure for all evils.

‘p.s. How was your imaginary trip to Sopron?’

I do not have to imagine trips to Sopron. My trips there are frequent. It is only a short flight away, and it is my beloved home town. I was there in good time to see the huge bus-in of Mesterházy rajongók. It is likely that no locals attended his address.

‘He said it was corrupt and debased.’

He demonstrated his own pukesomely debased condition.

‘… corruption is palpable and you could hardly argue against that.’

I do not want to argue against that. And, as you know, JOBBIK means to have the lot of them in jail, and soon. (The mega-corrupt are still in parliament and the civil service.)

‘… the video I linked to and see how the police look on indifferent’.

I did not look at it. I know you lot make a habit of faking these ‘videos’.

‘p.p.s Having said all that, Jackson is obviously a complete dick.’

What? Even you are better capable of seeing this than FL?

(to Jackson cont.)

"You are very young to be a "player" on these websites. You are "not in Kansas anymore" when you come here! If you understand what I am saying and will abide by the suggestions above, then I will agree to be a mentor and "big brother" to you. Break my rules, and you're on your own. I will plead with the others to allow for your youth and inexperience. what I don't want to see is a young Hungarian American become disillusioned and start to think that Hungary and the Hungarians are a waste of time. They are not!"

Enough said here. Let's all grow up!

Sorry: my last post was to Vandorlo.

The poor sixteen-year-old 'Jackson! He must be quite confused now. FL is all over him with appreciation one minute, then turns around and disciplines him the next. (Pathetic, FL.)

Again, I'm asking that we all grow up. We're dealing with a young person from another culture. He admits to being totally confused and bewildered by the reaction to his comments. Let's help him instead of calling him names.

You told me once that I would make a sympathetic parent. Now that I know how young he is, I'm offering to take on that role. You can help too, by engaging with him, and avoid the name calling.

@ FL: This ‘young person’ happened to confess to his age the very minute after I wrote my exposé of you? Now, what a coincidence! You, FL, are a maher. And you have blown your cover badly. (Mind you, it did fool me for quite a while.) You would like this to blow over, now? Uncomfortable for you?

@Elle: Laci, as always, is being more than decent in giving people the benefit of the doubt and letting them speak for themselves without the prejudice of imposing his opinions on them before they've hardly had a chance to articulate those views.
What Jackson writes is offensive, but I'm sure plenty of what I write offends you and visa versa. Laci is decent enough to respect each for their own.
Listening should never be made a criminal offense and is an extremely rare gift/skill/talent.
Honestly, you lot carry on like this and I'm starting a "Lay off Laci" campaign.

@ Elle

What on earth do crime statistics have to do with
with this whole fiasco?

The issue was FL responding in HIS OWN WAY to a poster . It is not up to you to attack another person and call him names because his answer displeased you and did not meet your approval.

I am not defending FL - he does not need my help, nor is he the issue. I am defending the right of individuals to post a response without being attacked by someone who exhibits the MO of a person who skipped her last dosage of Haldol.

I also have opinions which are not subject to your approval

(a) Despite your personal beliefs, you have not been appointed by Divine Power to protect Hungary's reputation while denying others the freedom to decide how to respond to accusations whether they are valid or completely without merit

(b)Your friend Law is not an authority on Jesus' teachings nor an authority on the definition of "willfully ignorant" or " innocently ignorant " I hope for his sake there is no claim that God has directly spoken to him and clarified the difference.

@ justasking

Sorry, I am not sure what you mean by "huh?"

If Jackson loved to travel to Hungary with his parents up to around 1995, that would make him all of ....1 year old! Nice story!

@ Vandorlo: 'Honestly, you lot carry on like this and I'm starting a "Lay off Laci" campaign.'

Well, he sure needs help. Muffed it, didn't he?

@ Olga; Huh?

@ Elle

I think you did not comprehend the part about not having Divine Power. I am sorry, I know it's hard to accept but once you do, there will be a huge burden lifted off your shoulders. Trust me, I have your best interest in mind.

So here is the good news - neither of us is Jackson's Mother.

What I am uncomfortable about is that we don't know the age of any given poster here, Erik puts no restrictions. I don't know if Jackson is a minor, but if he says so, I have to give him the benefit of a doubt. Those who relish verbal abuse should bear that in mind. I think 16 year olds are potentially impressionable and should not be subject ot the abuse that passes for discourse around here.

My further advice to Jackson is that he consult with his parents about further participation on these allhungary websites, and I think that goes for any other minor who visits these pages. If I were his actual parent, I would prohibit him from writing here. (Perhaps his Hungarian parents could supplement the education about Hungarians that he is already getting here.) A totally unmoderated website where people can engage in unlimited insults, including racial, political slurs, is not what I would want for my kid.

Nobody "exposed" me. Somebody writes that they saw live porn being filmed in the Heroes Square, or that Budapest is getting dirtier etc. and they get lambasted for that?

What would our grandparents think? I'll tell you what my grandmother would have thought of public porn filming in Budapest! She would have gone on a tirade for hours in very ugly Hungarian! She would say shame!

What someone should explain to Jackson is why he should feel muzzled about criticising what he sees in Hungary.

W

Well since you all asked, I'll give my opinion.

Jackson is not 16. What 16 year old talks about a countries currency and coal mining? What 16 year old cares about Hungary being in the EU?

What 16 year old would be offended by seeing porn live?

I heard this saying years ago and truly live by it now " If a person shows you their true personality...believe them"

I think the real controversy is about whether one can make negative observations around here about what they see in Hungary.

I see problems as something that need fixing, and
I don't mind people pointing them out.

Whatever Jackson's age, I'm offering him a chance to air out his concerns with me one on one, (provided he tone down his writing style), as I am patient and willing to explain to him why things are the way they are. I also want to emphasise that these are problems Hungarians would like to work out and resolve in the future. Whatever is happening, we always have to overcome and move on.

If this is not acceptable to him, then like I said, he is on his own and I leave him to the tender mercies of this community.

Elle: thanks for posting the 2009 crime stats report. As it happens, we both referred to the same 2005 report. I agree with you that Hungary is actually a relatively low crime country. Furthermore, the last time I looked, Hungary was about 43 on the Transparency International corruption index, meaning that although things certainly aren't great in that department, they sure aren't as bad as many other places. (of course that doesn't excuse the corruption that does exist, which must be dealt with accordingly)

@ Farkas,

Christ Laci! You act like we are a pack of wolves! :))

‘I think the real controversy is about whether one can make negative observations around here about what they see in Hungary.’
Farkas László at March 18, 2010 2:38 AM

No. The ‘real controversy’ here is that you gave yourself the alias ‘Jackson’ to spew obscene lies about Hungary, and that you are still pretending that you/Jackson said something worth considering as anything other than the sick fantasy it is. Alternatively, it about your chutzpah in imagining that you have fooled us.

So, I take it FL is proposing that now we set about rubbishing Hungary because his alias 'Jackson' is a sick creep who has 'seen' people having sex in Hősök Tér? Oh, now that is ingenious! FL undertakes to provide correspondents who fill English language sites about Hungary with filthy lies about Hungary. And he directs us to accommodate them! Ooooh, we will of course jump to do that! And you will explain ‘why things are the way they are’ in Hungary, will you FL? Well, I shall be on your tail, believe me. Understand, FL, that you have been exposed as a serious case of sicko! (Insulted? Oh, dear! How dare I? You are so full of love and good will, don’t-I-know.)

@ Cináed

I had not read your posts. Sorry I missed your reference. As for ‘the corruption that does exist, which must be dealt with accordingly’: JOBBIK intends to clean out parliament and the civil service. That will be 9/10ths of the job done. The new csendőrség, the police with a new leadership and the reconstituted army will be in place to secure us against the rest.

@Elle: The idea that Laci is Jackson is deranged. It really is.

"No. The ‘real controversy’ here is that you gave yourself the alias ‘Jackson’ to spew obscene lies about Hungary"

From where I'm sitting the chances of Laci=Jackson are so remote to make it virtually impossible to contemplate. Laci would have to have suddenly become pretty shit hot at covering his tracks, using proxies, switching his 'user-agent' signature etc... It just ain't gonna happen.

Really, you've lost it sweety.

Also, despite Jackson's apparently semi-decent education level (to contrast with Law and Ricsi), it isn't the same as Laci's and even a superficial comparison mark the two out as clearly distinct.

"...worth considering as anything other than the sick fantasy it is..." It is a sick fantasy, but it is all yours Elle. Just like your trip to Sopron. Get a grip!

Is this how Jobbiks are going to govern, just like the old days, people condemned on an unfounded and unsubstantiated suspicion?

Please Vindalooo any comment coming from a Soros and Bokros supporter has no credibility, your idols are white collar corrupt criminals, currently they have the judges in their back pockets, but not for long, where going to expose people who have stole our nation, so look out.

Jobbik pledges to be hard on crime
Jobbik pledges to be hard on crime
Jobbik pledges to be hard on crime
Jobbik pledges to be hard on crime
Jobbik pledges to be hard on crime
Jobbik pledges to be hard on crime
Jobbik pledges to be hard on crime
Jobbik pledges to be hard on crime
Jobbik pledges to be hard on crime

...while Jobbik spokesman pledges hard on?
ROFL
Sorry, I can't help myself.
http://kuruc.info/r/52/56812/

@ all

FL = Jackson?

What exactly does Elle have to post in order for people on this website to realize this woman has gone far beyond being a champion for Hungary?

Does the term "witch hunt" comes to anyone's mind?

This whole "controversy" was ignited by one individual.

I have never felt the need to assume an alias around here and have never posted under any other username than what you all know me by. I have never felt the need to. I didn't go around insulting people here, and besides that, I am a self confident individual, and so I never felt the need to post as anyone other than Farkas László, and I never will.

Dear Zsuzsa,

He would get trouble from some, as I just did, and that would be my concern. I'm trying to defuse a situation where on the one hand someone feels they ought to be able to make critical comments about Hungary, versus someone who feels he shouldn't. Jackson can do what he wants, but has said that he is reluctant to migrate to this website. I don't blame him; I cn just imagine what shit and abuse he'd get if he did.

I think the real controversy is about whether one can make negative observations around here about what they see in Hungary.
Farkas László at March 18, 2010 2:38 AM
=====
I see it just the other way around. On these lists, any Hungarian hating slime can come and dump garbage on Hungary and there is always some who treat this slime anything other than slime.
Ady and other notable Hungarian poets and writers wrote a lot of negatives about Hungary but they also vigorously defended Hungary from those outsiders who tried to slime Hungary. I do not have the exact wording but when Ady slapped a British newsman from writing slime about Hungary, he was asked if he was not doing the same thing. Ady responded that he does it for love of Hungary while the British newsman was doing it to ridicule Hungary.
I do not believe that you handled this slime ball properly. At the minimum, you could have said nothing and leave it to others to tell this Jackson slime where to go.
I would have told them that he can thank his mű-israeli relatives for the conditions in Judapest but things will improve soon after the current Communist mű-israeli government is kicked out.
I would have reminded him that we can thank his mű-israeli relatives for the spread of smut not only in Hungary but everywhere they are allowed to spread their filth.
I would have reminded him that, thanks to the Communist mű-israeli government, Jewish smut peddlers are having a free run in Hungary and that Jobbik will clear them out also.
I would have assured him that as soon as the mű-israelis are out of the picture, the city will be cleared of prostitutes, criminals and pornographers.
I would have told him that Hungary will be cleaned up when the new sheriff takes over and start packing if he does not like it.

I think it fair to assume that I have no stake in this FL controversy, one way or another.

However, I can only repeat what I said when I myself came under accusations of sock-puppetry some time ago. (you know who you are)
The point being that unless and until Erik introduces some sort of email validation of Comment IDs, which is something well well overdue, such accusations will remain the kind of thing against which it is impossible to defend yourself.

Though small fry by comparisson I feel it remiss not to mention, that those who call themselves Nationalists would do well to remember this is precisely the kind of accusation (where the accussee has no means of defense) that Budaházy and Hungary's other political prisoners face. Just try and remember that.

Dear Big Jim,

If he is reading here, then I certainly believe you just told him!

I still can't believe it:

Elle (who obviously tells lies all the time about her whereabouts, her trips to Hungary and maybe also about her sex) argueing FL = "Jackson" ???

Then at the end of course bj comes in "it's all the jews' falult, throw the jews out, kill all communists jews ..."

What has all this crazyness in common with today's Hungary's problems ?

At least the loonies show everybody who has the stamina to read this crap, what they really are ...

@ Farkas Laszlo

I don't really think this is really about you any more.

As you know, I grew up in Canada and the only "enemy" I was warned about were the pre 1989 Communists. No mention was made of their race or religion

I was told about how they fabricated stories without any basis and people "disappeared" in the middle of the night never to be heard from again.

I also wrote that my parents tried to leave Hungary in 1949, got caught served time in jail (no mistreatment; just in jail was enough) When they returned to their apartment in BP, they feared they would be deported "videkre" - I am sure you know what I am talking about, people got kicked out of BP and banished to live with strangers outside the city . It never happened but the fear was always there.

When Oszkar Molnar made unfounded allegations about Roma women, it was to incite hatred against the Roma.

When Big Jim/Mark Ricsi et al go on the attack , they attack either groups of people according to race and religion or individual politicians. Attacking politicians is part of the political game and thank God Hungarians can participate in the sport since 1989

In my opinion, Elle has every marking of belonging to the group of people my Dad feared in Hungary.

They invented trumped up "charges" and lies against an individual without a scintilla of evidence. Same shit, different day

Dear Big Jim,
If he is reading here, then I certainly believe you just told him!
Farkas László at March 18, 2010 2:26 PM
===
For what it is worth and I really like Elle and enjoy her spunky posts, I do not think that you and Jackson could possibly be the same person. You are too nice, much too nice for my taste but I do not see you posting as anyone but yourself.
I suspect that Elle does not think it either. What if someone forged Elle’s name?

@ BJ

My God!!! You are actually human and have some redeeming qualities. Things don't add up, do they?

You cannot believe it was Elle. Believe it.

IMHO only two people on this website have been cut from the same cookie cutter - Elle and Law

Rest Assured FL: you don't need to defend yourself or your identity. Not that it's for me to give advice to you, but my humble suggestion is to get back to doing what you do best and leave the arguing about this to others.
-
I for one am interested to hear more about your experiences and views. I would still like to hear about the communist years and the time leading up to and following the transition. (if you want to talk about it)

Brilliantly put, BIG JIM! I think for the moment that FL, who is so respected on this board, will not be putting up another ‘16-year-old’ filth pedlar for our gracious accommodation. (Of course, FL’s protégés – to whom, he admonishes, we must give sympathetic hearing – would have been the brilliant way of turning this board into an unmitigated Hungary-maligning one.)

@bobs: ‘sock-puppetry … such accusations will remain the kind of thing against which it is impossible to defend yourself’. Why are you addressing this to ‘people who call themselves Nationalists’? It seems to me that this is the stock-in-trade of the Vándorlós, Bystanders, wolfis and Vikings of this board. Also, do you not find it a little strange that FL was able to conjure up “Jackson’s” ‘I’m 16 years old’ story the minute the connection between the two of them is suggested – close to midnight at that?

Dear Jim

"I suspect that Elle does not think it either. What if someone forged Elle’s name?"

Hey now, there's a theory!

Dear Cináed,

The transiition away from communism, both in Hungary and the Soviet Union, was to my recollection a "palace revolution", or rather a "revolution from above". The leaders themselves decided one day, or over a period of time, that they lacked faith in the old ideology and order, and it needed to be abandoned. This movement was started in earnest by Gorbachev in Russia.

Thoughout the 70's and 80's, appeasing western govts sought to curry favor with the leaders of the communist block by giving them all kinds of expensive gifts and perks. They often received Mercedes cars as presents; Brezhnev had a large collection of them. Over time I believe the leaders of the communist nations developed a taste for the luxury goods of the west, and realized that their societies were not going to be able to compete when it came to making such things. In Hungary in the 80's, several members of the central committee had admitted to losing their faith in communism and desiring a transition to a western type economic system.

The seeds of Hungary's future corruption and class differences were sown in that era. The communist leaders received billions from the west, even then, which they spent as they pleased. Eventually, privatisiation for personal benefit and a "free trade" market economy suited those who had developed rich, champagne tastes and were in a position to benefit from it all.

FL: whichever way, it seems the communist leaders were 'wise' enough to see the writing on the wall and took the path most likely to see them rich and out of jail...which they were clearly right about.
-
I agree that a less 'velvety' revolution would have been better...at least one that involved a bit of justice. What was the mood of the people during this time? You see, I know a bit from the outside, and the general stuff that is reasonably well known, but what is hard to find is actual first-hand testimony.

Dear FL and Cináed:

At least in East Germany the pressure by the people on their communist leaders har risen during the 80s to an "unaccepatable level".

There even was talk about a mobilisation of the armed forces against "the street" ...

From reports I've heard it must have been unbearable. I didn't get the whole thing because I was on a trip in the US west from the end of october 89 - so I saw it on American tv first ...

At first we thought they were showing a kind of sci-fi film about the Berlin wall coming down and people traveling/fleeing to the west - then we realised it was the news. Really strange feeling ...

What I consider the worst part of it was that most Western politicians had not realise (or did not want to realis) that the communist system was rotten to the core. Instead of catching up withe the capitalist West, they lost more and more - the Socialist economy was just not viable in the long run, much too inefficient, dependent on giant subsidies from the West.

West Germany had been pumping billins of Marks into Eastern Germany for example - but nobody told us (the common people).

That's one thing for example which I'll never forgive or Social Democrats for: They were having talks with the communists in East Germany about a common program! Unbelievable stupidity or what ? I still wonder - they just did not see "The writing on the wall" - and they were against reunification of Germany.

continued:

Some SPD politicians obviously were so blind that they thought Socialism could develop into something viable - or they were just stupid or they just fed us lies.

I still haven't found out what they really believed ...

PS: I also had some acquaintances in the West German communist party. They told me once in our local bar (it was in the mid 80s) that Est Germany would soon be on the same level or better than West Germany: economically, culturally and son. I was stunned and still don't know: Did they really believe that crap ?

(B-elle)my darling shitbag - you are so constipated the shit dribbles from your mouth like an open sewer.
What do you have to say - about anything?
The drivel you indulge in could be heard at any remedial juvenile delinquent class. Fuck off!!!

I nominate Hells(B)elles also for the Golda Meir award for showing us what they really are.

wolfi: thanks. I copied that post to a word document. I did know that the west was pumping huge amounts of money into the nearer communist bloc countries to destabilise it. Sadly, in the process, what they managed to achieve was making a bunch of communists filthy rich, while leaving the rest of the country with crippling debt. I've said it before and I'll say it again. Hungary should by rights be a candidate for debt relief from the west, BECAUSE the west has already received their 'interest'.

Lovely. Just as one expects from your kind. I suppose you, too, are 16 years old?

@ Big Jim and Elle

Concerning Hell's(B)elle's postings and your postings.

How do you say "'What's good for the goose is good for the gander'" in Hungarian?

@OLga
It does not surprise me at all that you eat up Hell's(B)elle's filth as if it were candy. If that is what you like to do then it is your business. Do not expect me to explain why you hate your own kind and love those sadistic murderers who tortured your people to death. You have to find out why you hate those you have no reason to hate. Ask me no questions because I just do not know what made you like that. If it makes you happy, you get a Golda Meir award also.

BlowJob wrote: \"You have to find out why you hate those you have no reason to hate.\"
-----
BJ do you -realize- the irony of you being mad at someone else\'s filthy/hate-filled postings or are you -stupid- in addition to being intolerant?
--
My guess is the second of the two.

Those jobos write so much about sex and and ... I really wonder does bj give or take Blow Jobs from/to Law or Elle or ...

So here is a limerick I stole from somewhere:

A lesbian girl from Khartoum

Took a pansy boy up to her room.

As she turned out the light,

She said to him, "Right,

Who does which and with what and to whom?"

@ BJ

Re: "It does not surprise me at all that you eat up Hell's(B)elle's filth as if it were candy. "

Where exactly did you get the idea that I was impressed with the posting? I was not
I simply didn't see any difference between his style and yours. The sad part is that you do

The two most polite posters on this website, who to the best of my knowledge NEVER engaged in name calling, are Farkas Laszlo and Cinaed.

Only one qualifies by JOBBIK standards as "Tiszta Magyar" - Look at the way you and your friends treat him because you didn't like his response. He became a liar and a traitor within hours.

I actually misunderstood one of your postings and thought you were defending him and free speech My mistake.

Moreover, the sound of paranoia thunders on your group's postings. Thank God you can do no harm to Hungary because of the already discussed profile of website's readership.

@Elle. At a 7 now, well at least that's better. But now it's incorporating an Internet conspiracy theory or two ROFL

Wow, you and Law (who, as far as I remember is an Australian with Hungarian parents living, maybe, in Budapest) really should get together sometime...

@FL. I've been reading this site for 4yrs now. Those of us who know the comment threads round here and who try to be less biased and partisan know your style and who's in the right in this 'Jackson' fiasco. As ever, you've dealt with it with civility, good humour and patience. Kudos to you.

@Olga: "How do you say 'What's good for the goose is good for the gander' in Hungarian?" I don't know this one and though it's known in French and some other languages (mainly in the form 'sauce for the goose, sauce for the gander') there doesn't appear to be anything like this directly in Hungarian. The simplest thing is to express the idea of what's good for one person is good for the other "ami jó az egyiknek, az jó a másiknak is". Or rather, that a rule should be applied evenly "a szabály egyformán vonatkozik mindenkire." Just for reference 'gander' is 'gúnár'. The words lúd, liba, gúnár have all been doing the rounds due to the connection with Bajnai. If there were a phrase, it would have been well overused by now.

@ vanorlo

Thanks " ami jó az egyiknek, az jó a másiknak is"

Trouble is "az egyik" cannot see he is from the same cookie cutter" mint "a masik" and when someone points out the similarity, that someone becomes once again becomes the instant enemy.

For people who claim to "seek the Truth" they sure have a funny way of recognizing it

I will most likely be in Europe during the elections but unfortunately nowhere near Hungary. I have to keep in daily touch with Toronto,will take a laptop and check election results. I think you posted that you will be away from Hungary - Will you be checking up on "what's going on ?"

@Olga
Keep on pretending that you do not see the filth, hate and vile obscenities your chosen “people” posted just before your post.
There is no question who these “people” are and why the post so much filth and hate. That is the least one can expect from “people” who cluster bombs and white phosphorus bombs to murder little children and call it self-defense. These “people” commit unspeakable crimes against others while claiming to be victims of hate. For them, murdering women and children, destroying thousands of homes to make room for their “people” is not hate. For them, speaking up against their war crimes and crimes against humanity is hate. Not Hungarians but they murder people, women and children by the hundreds. Not Hungarians but they murder because they hate.

I would say that it was just a case of "ducking" the question genderly speaking.
What is good for the goose more often than not
is not good for the gander. Ironing shirts, washing up, brushing the floor, and so on.
Gender is problematical these days anyway;what with homos, transvestites, transexuals, lesbians, swing-both-ways brigade,
and the "don't knows" etc.
Therefore I submit the goose for the gander saying has past its sell-by date irrespective of the fact it doesn't exist in Hungary.

@Olga: I'm traveling with people who will be voting from Istanbul, so in a way it's unavoidable. To be honest, I'll be looking forward to something different, so will see how long I last. Every phone these days has a decent web browser, so it's hard to avoid. I have to keep other things running remotely, so am bound to sneak a look.

Nationalists would do well to remember this is precisely the kind of accusation (where the accussee has no means of defense) that Budaházy and Hungary's other political prisoners face
bobscountrybunker at March 18, 2010 2:25 PM
---
Clear and loudly 'bob' declares his solidarity with
"Budaházy and Hungary's other political prisoners"
What is the foundation to call them "political prisoners"?
* Amnesty International does not recognise them as "political prisoners"
.
* US State Department does not recognise them as "political prisoners"
.
* The EU (any body) does not recognise them as "political prisoners"
.
* The UN (any body) does not recognise them as "political prisoners"
.
but 'bob' does
We all fall to the ground and make the wave in admiration for 'bob's intellectual skills to discover what 'no one' else has done, except the supporters of these "political prisoners" of which 'bob' is one