[Editor's Note: The following is an op-ed piece by Geza Cseri, a member of the American Hungarian Federation, entrepreneur, and former science and technology advisor to NATO. Politics.hu welcomes submissions for op-ed pieces pertaining to Hungary.]
As the 90th anniversary of the Treaty of Trianon approached on June 4th the previous month, Hungarians across the four corners of the world commemorated the anniversary of the tragic event by which the dismemberment of historic Hungary occurred in 1920. This treaty totally altered the political balance of Central Europe. The Treaty deprived Hungary of 65% of her inhabitants and 72% of her territory, an area as large as Illinois, Indiana, Ohio and Kentucky combined. The dismemberment also created 16 million ethnic minorities, including 5 million Hungarians.
At that time, the great journalist Walter Lippmann called the event “balkanization”, which unfortunately proved to be true and thus contributed greatly to the events of WW II and more recently the Bosnian conflict and Kosovo. We have not seen the end of it, as Slovakia could be next due to its “Language Police” policy. President Wilson called the treaty absurd; the US Senate never ratified it.
The Kingdom of Hungary through its 1100 years of history with Poland played the stabilizing role in Central Europe. Whenever Hungary was strong there was peace in the Danubian Basin and when there was no real power in the area as at the time of the Ottoman invasion and recently after the 1920 dismemberment, the area was an open invitation for both Germany and Russia to maneuver to gain footholds there and thus basically dominate Europe, thus WW II.
Louis Kossuth, the great Hungarian patriot proposed a Danubian Confederation for the area (from the Baltic to the Adriatic) in the nineteenth century to act not only as a buffer from Eastern or Western invasion, but as a means of securing peace and prosperity for the area. Flora Lewis of the New York Times pointed out that Kossuth’s dream of a Danubian Confederation: “…might well have averted World War I and the ensuing tragedies. It is worth another look now.”
As recently as 1990, following the fall of the Iron Curtain, an attempt was made towards such confederation by the so-called “Visegrad Four”, but the effort has not gathered enough steam due to a lack of interest by world leaders. Perhaps the time is ripe now as a result of the change in government in Hungary to reopen the initiative and do something constructive.
To remedy the errors of the past, I suggest the resurrection of Kossuth’s dream of a federation which guarantees self-determination through plebiscites – which were denied in 1920 – and which provide autonomy to all ethnic minorities. The Danubian Federation would respect the right of all minorities to maintain their heritage and determine their own destiny, no matter how they evolved. Once that is achieved, peace may become a reality.
Let us step outside the box and think of new ways to work toward peace. It would be fitting if in the year of the 90th anniversary of the dismemberment of the Hungarian Kingdom, and after the unnecessary and undeserved suffering of three generations of innocent ethnic minorities, the leaders of the world, including President Obama, would support the initiative for the formation of a Danubian Federation and thereby eliminate the power vacuum in Central Europe and reduce the threat of constant armed tension as currently exists due to the fermentation of ethnic hatred by Slovakia.
The key to stabilize Europe is the elimination of ethnic tensions by guaranteeing ethnic rights and autonomy throughout the region. We must do this not only for our own sake and peace but because it is the right thing to do. To paraphrase President Lincoln: “Nothing is settled for good until it is settled justly.”
Ah, more romanticizing about the Kingdom of Hungary. All minorities were happy under Hungarian rule.
Sorry, Bro, the Trianon Treaty will stand until the end of Europe. And Europe will be here as long as humanity survives …
Yeah, it’s funny:
“The dismemberment also created 16 million ethnic minorities …”
So what were those people (Croatians, Slovenians, Slovakians etc) before in Hungary, slaves or serfs of the Hungarian nobility ?
No ruler in the 19zh century gave a damn about “ethnicity”, especially not the Austrian/Hungarian …
You two imbeciles don’t know, don’t understand and definitely don’t have a say in this matter.
Go prepare for your parade.
A “Danubian Federation” has been, and continues to be unattainable. There is not enough mutual trade or trust to make it fly, and underneath it all are the underlyig territorial disputes-legacies of history.
Kossuth was one of the few members of his Magyar noble class who traveled to America in the mid nineteenth century. Such travel I believe opened his eyes to a number of possibilities, but by then, his cause was lost back home. For Kossuth’s “Federation” to really work in the Danubian basin, you would have needed labor mobility, occupational choice and the free movement of people and capital. In other words, a less feudal order. The animosities of the 20th century are still with us, and run deep. The nations in question stand a better chance of cooperating within the EU, than amongst each other.
I’m glad to see Cseri mentioned plebescites. To bring those about, you would not necessarily need to have the “Federation”. A group or region within a country can always call for a referendum on secession. (Whether such a bid will get any diplomatic and great power support, is another matter.)
Why is it that on Hungarian web sites , there always have a bunch
non Hungarians commenting on things they know nothing about or
couldn’t understand.
The only reason the minorities became unhappy in the old kingdom
was because of Austrian and German meddling.
i am convinced Wolfi is anti Hungarian and don’t know what the hell
he’s talking about .
As for the American in Budapest you are an american so that says it
all.
Well there’s a saying that a wisdom doesn’t necessarily come with age. Sometimes age just shows up all by itself.
Also, this op-ed piece cannot be explained otherwise, but by a serious cloud of author’s judgement.
Self-professed American “expert” presenting answers to poignant problems of Central Europe. Or rather the patches to never ending Trianon moans. Millions of people paid the highest price for Europe to be peaceful and stable continent in the Wars.
Author foresightedly proposing a serie of plebiscites has neglected to mention how often such plebiscites should be repeated. Every 20 or 30 years after the ethnical composition of Europe will change, or just once so that ethnical Hungarians would settle? Brilliant ideas indeed. Borders of American states are reorganized on regular basis as well?
And all that nailed by confident proclamation that Obama would support the initiative. Where the author got that information from? Or has he forgotten that United States are the warrantors of the peace treaties signed after WWI, including Trianon treaty?
A Great Hungary could have been powerful. Now, thanks to Trianon, we have a bunch of small countries, barking at each-other instead of dealing with important problems, like how to survive the final days of liberal western capitalism. Never mind the borders, they were put there to divide people with common goals and values.
It’s easier to colonize us if we keep fighting each other instead of protecting our interests.
This is just a dream far from reality
Few comments anyway:
“The Treaty deprived Hungary of 65% of her inhabitants ” – and most of them welcomed that “deprivation”
“The dismemberment also created 16 million ethnic minorities” – I doubt the number is correct. Anyway, let first enumerate number of non-magyars living in hungary before 1918 as ethnical minorities to compare with post-1918 status.
Possibility of slovakia being the source of next war conflict – that guy has no touch with reality here in central europe
Idea of danubian federation – now when we have EU I dont see any real advantage in comparision to EU…
“…result of the change in government in Hungary…” – The guy is very optimistic about new hungary government. Anyway – it is your problem…
“… which were denied in 1920…” – 1918 is the year when national states were declared within former teritory of hungary.
“It would be fitting if in the year of the 90th anniversary of the dismemberment” – sorry Trianon and its anniversaries are completely meaningless and irrelevant to all except for you.
I take it as romantizing view at central europena affairs. Hm, view of a magyar.
cont:
Anyway, I don’t want to be completely negative about the idea, I appreciate objectives of this idea – peace and stability in central europe
“The Treaty deprived Hungary of 65% of her inhabitants and 72% of her territory, an area as large as Illinois, Indiana, Ohio and Kentucky combined.”
Mr. Cseri clearly doesn’t know what he is talking about. All numbers given here are square kilometers.
Present day Hungary: 93,030
If Hungary lost 72% then the original territory was 332,250. The lost 72% equals 239,220.
The combined area of the 4 US States cited = 456,074.
The difference is 216,854, more than twice the size of present day Hungary.
Not to mention the inconvenient fact that there was NO INDEPENDENT HUNGARY at the time for more than 3 centuries. The total size of the KUK Monarchy was 676615, by the way.
President Wilson was no friend of Hungary.
Walter Lippman was a communist sympathizer.
The rest of the article is pure delusion.
Go back to grade school before curing the ills of the world, please.
http://web.interware.hu/pmakrai/geocities/vegyes/hungtria.gif
Others have already posted most of what I was going to write, but I wanted to point out to “Common Sense” that a Great Hungary would not have been nearly as large as Poland is now, and would not have survived for very long, considering all the aggrieved minorities inside its borders. Ask the Yugoslavs (sorry, the Serbs, Croats, Slovenes, et al) whether “common goals and values” were enough to keep them from violently breaking apart. And they mostly shared a language!
Alex, when you say, “The only reason the minorities became unhappy in the old kingdom
was because of Austrian and German meddling”, why don’t you explain further and back up your assertion with at least some biased links? Oh, right, because you only parrot what someone with a loud voice tells you, instead of doing some real research of your own. Are you trying to tell me that Hungary would have been the only country in the world where minorities who speak entirely different languages from the oppressive majority would have been happy to continue to be second class citizens? I’m sure there would have been civil war at some point, which would have either split the country up anyway or resulted in national strength being sapped.
Therefore, the old kingdom would have been anything but “powerful”, even if it had survived into the communist era, where it would have suffered the same fate as Poland and Romania, neither of which are or were powerful.
You right-wingers should be eternally grateful for Trianon, since it gives you someone other than jews to blame for the failures of Hungary. Aside from the obvious fact that a Trianon-like split was inevitable, you can always say, “if not for those envious western countries, we would rule Europe by now”, without actually confronting the fact that Hungarians haven’t done much with their freedom since 1989.
After the Napoleonic Wars and the Franco-Prussion War, France lost a lot of land, but the French still managed to build themselves back up to wealth and power. Then there’s Germany, which lost plenty of land after both world wars, much of it majority German. Are they sitting around complaining and blaming? No, they’re busy working hard, sacrificing, and staying out of debt, while creating the second-largest trade surplus in the world. With all the ethnic Germans in Hungary, you’d think that would be the role model to emulate.
Instead of always looking for another scapegoat, why not just work hard and sacrifice, like most wealthy countries have done?
At the same time, I do believe Trianon was unfair, and should have given majority-Hungarian areas a chance to vote for the country they would like to join; but then you right-wingers might have to face reality. Nah, there’s always the tiny percentage of Hungarian jews and Roma to blame all your problems on! You’d just better hope that they don’t all leave you here without scapegoats…
@Alex and All
Re: “Why is it that on Hungarian web sites , there always have a bunch
non Hungarians commenting on things they know nothing about or
couldn’t understand.”
Just a wild guess, but maybe because it’s an English speaking website?
I really liked this paragraph, but it’s plagiarism. Pollyanna said it first. (Perhaps she took it back in “Pollyanna Grows up}
“The Danubian Federation would respect the right of all minorities to maintain their heritage and determine their own destiny, no matter how they evolved. Once that is achieved, peace may become a reality.”
Hungary is a strange place to talk about respecting “all minorities” – how about starting with two?
We don’t “blame all our problems” on jews and gypsies. Only the problems they cause.
Obviously you brainwashed minority-lovers have no idea of what’s really going on in Hungary.
You were trained to go for the all-or-nothing bs.
If we don’t like what some jews are doing, we are automatically labeled as “anti-semites”, and we must hate all jews.
If we don’t enjoy the barbaric attacks by some gypsies, then we must be racists, who hate all minorities.
If we don’t enjoy looking at obscene parades, we must hate all gays.
Life is not that simple. You are.
Now here’s a question you probably cannot answer:
What’s in it to you? Taking sides with minorities you are not familiar with, based on rumors you picked up in your one-sided media, so what is the purpose of your mindless support for hostile, anti-Hungarian groups? Is there any reason behind your madness?
what is the purpose of your mindless support for hostile, anti-Hungarian groups? Is there any reason behind your madness?
Common Sense at July 9, 2010 6:11 PM
.
Yes, to save you from yourself!
We don’t “blame all our problems” on jews and gypsies. Only the problems they cause.
Obviously you brainwashed minority-lovers have no idea of what’s really going on in Hungary.
You were trained to go for the all-or-nothing bs.
If we don’t like what some jews are doing, we are automatically labeled as “anti-semites”, and we must hate all jews.
If we don’t enjoy the barbaric attacks by some gypsies, then we must be racists, who hate all minorities.
If we don’t enjoy looking at obscene parades, we must hate all gays.
Life is not that simple. You are.
Now here’s a question you probably cannot answer:
What’s in it to you? Taking sides with minorities you are not familiar with, based on rumors you picked up in your one-sided media, so what is the purpose of your mindless support for hostile, anti-Hungarian groups? Is there any reason behind your madness?
a bit of history for Geza Cseri
The initiative of the first DANUBIAN CONFEDERATION
rested more with the Romanian than the Magyar
émigrés. As early as May 1848, the Romanian
representative, Dumitru Bratianu, went to Pest to
disc uss the construction of a confederation with
the Hungarian president, Lajos Batthyany. Later,
in Debrecen in 1849, the Romanian leader, Nicolae
Balcescu, discussed with Kossuth the possibility
of joint cooperation between the Hungarian and
Romanian revolutionary movements. Balcescu had
already made converts of the Hungarian General
György, Klapka, and Kossuth’s minister in Paris
Laszlo Teleki. Balcescu and Ion Ghica’s
correspondence developed the of idea establishing
the confederation.
In January 1850, Balcescu drew up a constitution
for the Romanians, Magyars, and South Slavs in
which a plebiscite to replace old historic borders
and boundaries with new ethnic borders in each
state ..but when Ghica approached Kossuth, who was
in exile in Turkey until 1851, with the Romanians’
proposal, he rejected it, even though Hungarian
émigrés in London endorsed it.
http://www.ohio.edu/chastain/dh/danconf.htm
Common Sense,
We are several levels intellectually above you.
Rantings and ravings about minorities are typical signs of a culture under economic stress. For example, anti-semitism bloomed under the Weimar Republic’s hyperinflation.
I have met many Hungarians here in the capital who agree that the Hungarian mentality is the chief enemy.
Frankly, it is primitive compared to what I see in the Czech Republic.
Common Sense,
Get over your obsession with Hungarian Power. The size of a country does not determine its standard of living.
A bigger Hungary would simply mean that Hungarian mismanagement would play out on an even larger scale.
Hungary is a country that dragged its feet on privatisation and thereby fell way behind the Czech and Slovak Republics.
Even today the government still owns zombie businesses that should either be shut down or sold off.
Similarly, Hungarian agriculture languishes because Hungary of the few EU nations that has foreign ownership restrictions on land.
Anyone can buy in the States or France or Germany or Sweden or the UK or …
“Get over your obsession with Hungarian Power.”
Never. No way.
“The size of a country does not determine its standard of living.”
Size matters. Ask your girlfriend why she left you.
“Hungary is a country that dragged its feet on privatisation and thereby fell way behind the Czech and Slovak Republics.”
Privatization is not the answer. Better management is.
“Hungarian agriculture languishes because Hungary of the few EU nations that has foreign ownership restrictions on land.”
Bullshit. The land is all we have left. It’s not for sale. If you want to grow pumpkins here, lease a piece of land.
The problems with agriculture in Hungary will not be solved by selling off strategic assets. It’s more complicated than that. Multies keep wholesale prices below reasonable levels, the EU only supports France and Germany, we have sold and eventually destroyed processing plants and so on. I can never find Hungarian made canned fruits any more. The plants are closed, producers are stuck with the fruit, and the shelves are empty. Why?
Privatization in Hungary means sell it cheap to anyone who’s willing to bribe you. The plants then go broke due to mismanagement or more profitable use of the property. How does that help Hungarians?
Privatization is not the answer. Better management is
The plants then go broke due to mismanagement or more profitable use of the property. How does that help Hungarians?
Common Sense at July 10, 2010 7:08 AM
—
1) Privatization makes better management
2) “more profitable use of the property”
Yes, is that not wonderful?
That is what privatization makes, “more profitable use of the property” and that helps the ‘Hungarians’
Well maybe not those, like you, who miss the Good Ol’ Kadar Time and its canned fruit
Try the fresh stuff
I have no problem buying local produce, even in Budapest. They are selling it at every street corner and they have no need to put it on cans
But please, why don’t you do like your old Grand Mother and can it yourself?
Your ideas and outlook seems definitely to have been canned from ‘a brighter past’
“Privatization makes better management”
How?
“more profitable use of the property”
A profitable company that produces goods people need is good for everyone.
Selling the property to some foreign investor who will lay off all the workers, sell everything that isn’t nailed down, then either “develop” another fucking golf course or just leave the ruins and a big fat mortgage behind and disappears. Is that good for us?
I have no problem with privatization when it means better management, better productivity, modernization, higher wages, etc., without turning something useful into something useless.
So far in most case this hasn’t been the Hungarian model. Quite the opposite.
If we want better management, hire better managers. If we trust the government to run the country, why cannot we trust them to run a simple business? Are they that incompetent? Replace them.
@Common – You are dreaming here, buddy. Your Karl Marx University economics are dangerous in the present world. Better management doesn’t just fall from the sky. Companies in all industries the world over are using Lean techniques to just to survive. This means reducing size & waste, increasing output, using technology, & working with less capital & staff, but more competition. Better management only comes about, or evolves only when you compete with others, learn from them, improve & innovate on what you have. 3rd world companies were already doing that long ago. Just look at small companies from Korea, Malaysia, Brazil & Bahrain to name just a few. Why do you think the Sony plant is moving to Malaysia from Godollo? It originally moved from Malaysia to here.
Agriculture is not going to save Hungary. It simply doesn’t provide enough value to sustain a high standard of living. Look at any rich country, and agriculture employs and contributes less than 5% to GDP. Richer countries population spend less than 10% of their income on food, the other 90% goes towards manufactured goods and services. Let the companies which can make something out of agriculture do it in Hungary. All HGungarian companies need to understand and find business models which provide value to the customers(even serving multi’s & competitors, if necessary). Only countries & companies which understood the importance of serving customers made it past the last round in the 90s.
@Common – cont’d… Size doesn’t matter – your ex-girlfriends all lied! Don’t be so obsessed with creams, lotions and pills (or Trianon) for now. There are more pressing issues for Hungary (maybe, also for you). Slovakia is half your size, and they have overtaken you in 10 short years. Many other small countries have done fine with multi investment. My own country has many multis & we’re doing okay. Hungarian land isn’t as valuable, or the key asset you think it is. I know someone from my country who bought a ranch & farm in Australia amounting to 4.8% of Hungary’s land area for $5m in the 90s. You think a Hungarian farmer can compete with him? Right now, you guys are trying to sell us chicken, and we are selling you electronic parts. Who do you think will get richer? The ONLY significant thing going to my country from Hungary is Suzuki cars. Hungary hadn’t been able to sell a single Ikarus bus in all this time. You still multi’s don’t have an important role in Hungary?
@Clueless: “I know someone from my country…”
—
Garbage and lies. Do not tell us stories about your country if you are so ashamed of your country that you keep it a secret. You must have very good reasons to be ashamed of your country and your people and we will not ask you to tell us about it but the least you can do is not lie and post garbage about your country.
Common Sense,
A few more corrections.
Hungarian land will be for sale to anyone who wants it because the EU will eliminate the ban this year.
There is really two Hungaries: the backward, poor, largely old, and rabidly nationalist Hungarians, and the young, well educated and affluent Hungarians
who are largely tolerant.
It is obvious which group you belong to …
I have just spent a week in magnificent Budapest.
Public service, attitude, and general administration, are shit.
Who the fuck is in control of that city?
Root out the last of the commies and drown them in the Danube. Alternatively, put them on a boat to Cuba or Venezuela where they will be welcomed with open arms.
A profitable company that produces goods people need is good for everyone
Common Sense at July 10, 2010 2:30 PM
—
Could you list any Hungarian companies, not owned by any foreign company that do this?
When you are ready with that list, do the next list where your description:
“Selling the property to some foreign investor who will lay off all the workers, sell everything that isn’t nailed down, then either “develop” another fucking golf course or just leave the ruins and a big fat mortgage behind and disappears”
fits in
-
And who actually financed that “big fat mortgage”
Was that not a bank owned by a bad multi?
So what is the problem some bad multi banks lose money?
CG
Things are a lot more complicated in Hungary.
Two decades ago we wandered off the beaten path and got lost in the jungle. We have made all the wrong turns and run out of supplies. We’ve had leaders like Moses, who could not find his way out of a paper bag.
We could easily fill a book on when, where and how we screwed up, but it’s no use, we have to cut our losses and start over.
If we learned something from the past is that irresponsible, loose capitalism doesn’t work.
Corrupt, wasteful and bureaucratic socialism is not the solution either.
Pulling a reverse Robin Hood, taking money from the poor and giving it to the rich is now very popular in Europe, but would not work very well for us. The poor spend all their money on food and other necessities, instead of piling it up in offshore accounts.
What we can do is take a good, fresh look at what resources we have left, and make the most of them. Not by selling, but by getting the people involved in saving the country. A little extra effort can go a long way. Hungary was broke and ruined before, see the results of the two world wars. We can do it again if we stop dividing people with phony minority issues, and dirty politics. United we stand, divided we fall.
We in slovakia have very similar situation, it looks like Slovakia citizens are split in two equal halfs, a view of first half is „State should take care“, and second half believes: „State ownership bring inefficiency, corruption, and enrichement for individuals….“
And these halfs (or rather political parties representing these views) alternates in governing the country…
CS – Hungary’s experience was not different from the other CEE & CIS countries. There was no accepted way to make the transition to a market economy, & countries experimented with varying degrees of control & success. China addressed only the economic transition & not the political.
I dont think Hungary needs to cut its losses and start from scratch. With competition changing the marketplace daily, you might not be able to rebuild the parts that do work. Do you want to give up multis which pay higher salaries & contribute more to Hungary’s GDP than local firms. Your resources should be directed towards ensuring that those things remain in Hungary. As I mentioned to FL & Advocate some time back, once an MNC comes into our country, we try to keep those higher paying jobs, by understanding their requirements & tailoring our educational system to produce graduates which meet their ‘future needs’. Eg we would work with Tesco not to build their retail business, but working with them to produce a strong logistics sector (which they need), but which would also benefit Hungary in other areas. The resources would go into producing graduates who could form the basis of a competitive logistics industry.
I think Hungarians would focus on addressing its economy, minority issues & neighbors more constructively if people understood that even if you pulled together, you might not overcome this uphill battle. Change the garda uniform to pink tutu’s and half your problems would disappear.
CG
Hanging onto the sinking ship of globalisation may not be the best choice. In the age of overpopulation and depleting resources the future is not in mass producing more and more useless crap and manipulate people to live in debt slavery to buy them. Maintaining some level of independence can be a life saver. Hungary should make an effort to independently produce most of the goods people really need, by encouraging and supporting local SMEs, instead of giving tax breaks and special treatment to multies. Of course not all multies are the same. The ones that simply take over businesses we could handle on our own are not welcome. We may need others for undeveloped areas, but we should always make sure the deal is beneficial for both parties. So far that hasn’t been the case.
Arable land and drinking water are becoming rare commodities. Selling these would be a fatal error.
We have to look out for our own interests, no one else will do it for us.
The most successful East European economies are the Czech and Slovak. Their success has nothing to do with barriers to entry for foreign firms.
What will make or break Hungary are its people. Japan is one of the wealthiest countries in the world and has virtually no natural resources and little land.
So we get Commonsense’s parochial nationalism worrying about ‘keeping our assets’ when the key asset, human capital, can not be kept in Hungary.
@CS- There is no such a thing as independence now. It’s interdependence, & it’s not planned or organized by anyone. It’s just the evolution within the business world.
Why produce stuff that other people can do better? Even if an SME here produced stuff that you need, a department store selling a good import could put it out of business. Tesco/Carrefour are not competing with your SMEs, or trying to take them over. They’re providing a platform so that customers dont have to run to 10 places to see what is available in the market. Even if your SME produces better/cheaper stuff, they may still lose out if a competitor provides better buying conditions or customer service (eg better trade terms eg 60 days deferred payment instead of pre-payments or payment on delivery). All in, Hungarian companies need to look the competitive business environment & understand the opportunities available to them. They may need to change their products, collaborate & co-operate with other businesses or competitors, and maybe even change their business models to meet customers’ higher expectations. Producing to historical standards set by the state is a slow death. Giving a tax break to a multi employing 1000 people has more spin-offs than subsidising an uncompetitive SME which produces something that even Hungarians wouldn’t buy. What 100% Hungarian designed & manufactured product actually meets current int’l customer expectations?
@CS-Arable land in Hungary will always produce output which benefits Hungary regardless of who owns it. It cannot move & any output would utilise Hungarian resources (labour, services, logistics) to create wealth. If Hungary can’t produce anything useful for the populations in the high growth countries like China, Russia, Brazil, India, or Mexico besides food, then it’s game over. There are millionaires emerging faster in China than any other country. Today’s CNN had the average S class buyer there as 26 years old, opposed to 55 in other markets. How is Hungary trying to tap into that wealth? My friend became a millionaire in 1 year by setting up a restaurant catering to the wealthy in Russia. I was in India 3 years ago, and came across a hospital whose specialists screen x-rays, catscans, labtests sent over the internet for hospitals in the US. College professors in India also earn extra money by giving extra tuition over the internet to student in the US. If such countries can organize & do it, why not Hungary? There are so many avenues for Hungary to exploit. Why waste a country’s resources on protecting gay parades? Leave them be, dump your uniforms, and go clean up the city, and the police wont be trying to control garda parades.
Regarding consumerism & debt “slavery”. That happens if you’re too greedy & to keep up with the Joneses. Wealth inequality will always exist everywhere. Live with it. I still drive a 14 year old car with rust spots, but no debt.
@ George,
DD
Eww! You drive a rusty ol’ car! What a catch!
And before you thumb up your nose at me and enter into a pissing contest… I drive a 2010 Volkswagen Passat Wagon…with no debt.
As for the rest of your post…too true!
@JA – Some people look good in any car. Others need a 2010 VW Passat. Nice car, btw. Bet you get all the guys
@ George,
DD
Yup, that’s me…a virtual ‘dude magnet’ in my station wagon!!! AAARRRRR!!!!!!
Shit, I’m so hot…I don’t need a car! Mind you, sure makes it easier, packing a couple of kids and around !
” I’m too sexy for my car, too sexy for my car….
Curious/Justasking. Sorry to be the raspberry in your little tete a tete.
I have recently returned from a week in Budapest. Everywhere people complaining about how they could not afford to pay their gas and electricity bills whilst consuming huge amounts of alcohol and partying.
JA. You can pick me up anytime in your shiny new car.
Curious. I know you have a grip on reality and most of what you say about the economy and competition is correct. The trouble is no fucker will listen.
And those employed to administer and look after the interests of the country usually end up making a bodged bogracs. The two main ingredients – corruption and inefficiency.
Have a nice day!
@ Eper,
Bloody Hell your funny…
Hey did I mention that I have a ‘Panorama’ sun roof as well? Meet me at the Tesco, on Pillango Utca in 5….:)))
You’ll notice me from a mile away…my car is silver and Balazs Pali songs pouring out of my speakers at full volume…I have buck teeth with coke bottle glasses and long Rapunzel length dark brown greasy hair. Yeah Baby!!!
” Te vagy as igazi a nagy szerelem….”
@JA – Well, if you want to learn from an “expert” on how to fend off all those admirers, my classes start next week.
)
) I mentioned once that the both of us stick out like a sore thumb in Budapest, especially in that car!
Of course, for an old 4’10″ bald guy with one yellow tooth, it’s not just my car which is a little “rusty”:(
My wife’s been telling me to get it fixed for the past few months. I guess I better do it before she too begins to think I’m not the catch she once imagined. I’m too old to go thru more hair transplants, new wigs and replacing my dentures again, and start looking for a new wife (Besides, 3 of my students have already hit on her – they thought she was a visiting exchange student
@Eper – Thanks. Before you leave for your soiree with JA, did you find anything in your short trip to be positive about?
Factchecker- you are right and I thank you for pointing out my mistake. The statement: Illinois, Indiana, Ohio and Kentucky should have read Illinois, Indiana, Ohio or Kentucky. By refering to these states which roughly represent the size of the Kingdom of Hungary, I just wanted to give a pictoral illustration to the American readers for greater understanding as to the size.
Thanks again for correcting me.
But your other remarks show immaturity and not worth commenting on.
GC
@ Geza,
If you are in fact the author of this article and not some imposter, I would like to thank-you for submitting it.
I personally enjoy the way you write and hope that there are future articles you plan on sharing with us here on Politics.
Warm Regards,
Zsuzsa
Justasking- Zsuzsa. I hope you are real.
I am real, not an imposter. You can google me.
Thank you for your confidence.
My aim was to throw out an old idea that we could discuss in a sane positive manner even by dreaming (by the way, without a dream you are a dead fish). An idea on which we can work and thread a better community in harmony with each other for a peaceful better life for the area. What is wrong with that? Think about that!!!! Think what is possible. Don’t be negative. Be positive and see in everything opportunity for improvement. The game should not be who rules who but who can create the better future for all.
GC
@ Geza,
“Zsuzsa. I hope you are real.” Hold on a sec and I’ll just pinch myself:)) OUCH!
Yup, I’m real! Although they’re are some on this site that wish I weren’t :O
I take your advise and will be googling away!
As for the rest of your post, from your lips to God’s ears.
@ Geza
I liked your article – sounds like a wonderful idea
You are correct “without a dream you are a dead fish”
Question is – can Hungarians afford to dream? Can a person with cancer afford to dream of a cure or
or is immediate action needed to survive?
Makes me angry that former “East Block” countries are moving forward while Hungarians are asleep at the wheel dreaming.
You are obviously much more of an expert on Hungary than I am – so in your opinion, what’s the the countries best interest NOW?
You can’t dream of a different political scene either – the electorate has spoken, and for the next few years , it is what it is.
“Cancer” is on my mind because a relative has just been diagnosed with it and she was given various treatment options – cure was not one of them. Her “dream” is to survive – thus my question to you.
Austrians have succesfully left behind their nostalgy for failed Austro-hungarian monarchy and also for their failed participation on nacistic Germany.
Why Hungarians cant stop whining after 90 years after Trianon? Nothing better to care for? For example to prop up economy?
Geza,
Your article strikes me as one sided. The Trianon Treaty was a response to the legitimate demand for self-determination by Hungary’s minorities.
The Hungarian part of the Austro-Hungarian empire was noted for its repression of Slovak, German, and Roma minorities. The Great Compromise was not a day celebration for Hungary’s minorities.
There was no significant representation in Hungary’s parliament of these minorities and in fact hundreds of Slovak schools were shut down.
Add to that the increasing anti-semitism that occurred in the 1930s, which resulted in support of Nazi efforts to eradicate the Jewish population, and you have a history of persecution by a Hungarian majority that ironically views itself solely as a victim.
The Hungarians live this myth of being solely victims when in fact ‘everyone has sinned’.
I find it amazing that the Hungarian Federation would support Victor Orban when the latter’s understanding of democracy includes attempting to eliminate the independence of the Hungarian bank and virtually all other independent institutions. He tried to pack every independent organization of fully Fidesz party members.
Given Fidesz’ track record during its previous reign in power, I have little doubt they will commit the same mistakes. They will overspend and create inflation and the same cycle of misery will repeat itself.
The only good news is that the EU and the IMF can keep Orban’s anti-democratic tendencies in place.
Leaving all historic quarrels aside , the proposition , like others in the past , is indeed ridiculous one sided. Technically speaking , it’s a piece made by Hungarians for Hungarians and maybe for the international opinion ( excluding the countries who actually should be involved in the project)
90% of text are nostalgic Hungarian memories about their 1000 years kingdom ( touchy , but what is the relevance today for the countries that actually fought to put an end to it ?) , ranting about Trianon ( pretty awesome thing for the others) and waving minorities problems ( non existent concern for the others, as they don’t have critical amount of ethnics outside borders).
You don’t actually bother at least to simulate the care for what specific needs other might have and the specific reasons why they should join ( ironically in a proposition that promotes empathy, cooperation , etc)
Basically the cards put on the table are : lets make everything for the good of Hungarians NOW and maybe, just maybe , sometimes in a more or less distant future, we may or may not reach some kind of utopic golden age by closing the ties between some poor and mismanaged countries.
No wonder that nobody takes seriously this idea.
@Americans in Budapest
“The Hungarian part of the Austro-Hungarian empire
was noted for its repression of Slovak, German,
and Roma minorities.”
Are you serious? Are you law-historian or similar
specialist of the area? Can you cite a
discriminative law/decree for romanians slovaks in
from era of Austria-Hungary? You can’t.
Before the WW1, Austria-Hungary was the only
country in Europe, where the law-system and the
legislature knew the ethnic and minority rights.
The western legal-systems didn’t know the “ethnic
and minority rights in pre ww1 era.
Slovaks have more right than Irish people or
Scottish people in English ruled Britannia, where
they lost thir mother-tongue. France was the
country of minorities before the revolution. (The
central or French language was spoken as mother-
tongue only by 48-49% of the total population in
France. The other neo lation languages are
dissapeared until the 1890′s, because of forced
violent French nationalization policy, school-
policy press-policy.
Germans were the majority in Hungarian towns, and
they were the rich industrialist in the country.
Germans were the majority in Hungarian towns, and
they were the rich industrialist in the country
storage at August 8, 2010 4:04 PM
—
If the above was true and the below was true:
* Where were the ‘Hungarians’?
-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungarian_Jews#20th_century:_success.2C_persecution.2C_and_destruction
-
“The number of Jews according to the 1910 census was 5.0% of the 18 million people living in Hungary (Croatia excluded). The capital, Budapest, was 23% Jewish. At that time Karl Lueger, mayor of Vienna created the Antisemitic and Anti-Hungarian nickname Judapest, alluded to high number and percentage of magyarized Jewish population
The Jews of Hungary were fairly well integrated into Hungarian society by the time of the First World War
In 1926, there were 50,761 Jewish families living in Budapest. 65% of them lived in apartments that contained one or two rooms, 30% had three or four rooms, while 5% lived in apartments with more than 4 rooms”
If you check the link above you will find that the living standard in Budapest for the Jews compared to Christians shows that Jews was in general richer
The question is then if ‘Germans’ belong to the Jewish or Christian group?
Viking, learn more about Central Europe. The
majority and town founders were ALWAYS the Germans
in the great medieval Hungarian Kingdom, Poland
and Bohemia. You interested about “Jewish
Question” very frequently, perhaps you have Jewish
background from Sweden. What said the”Budapest
article of Encyclopedia Britannica in 1911?
“Politically, this ambitious and progressive
capital is the creation of the Magyar upper
classes. Commercially and industrially, it may be
said to be the work of the Jews. The sound
judgment of the former led them to welcome and
appreciate the co-operation of the latter. Indeed,
a readiness to assimilate foreign elements is
characteristic of Magyar patriotism, which has,
particularly within the last generation, made
numerous converts among the other nationalities of
Hungary, and – for national purposes – may be
considered to have quite absorbed the Hungarian
Jews. It has thus come to pass that there is no
anti-Semitism in Budapest, although the Hebrew
element is proportionately much larger (21% as
compared with 9%) than it is in Vienna, the Mecca
of the Jew-baiter.”
Dear Viking! You must read the article of the two
and very different type of nationalism.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_nationalism
and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civic_nationalism
, the ethnic type or “race-based” nationalism is a
hotbed of nazism. The ethnic nationalism appeared
in Hungary only in the 1930s. But the 1930s is not
our debated era. If you study the development of
Hungarian nationalism, you can see, that it (and
its ideas) was constructed by the higher nobility
of Hungary, who weren’t Hungarians by the terms of
ethnicity. The Noblemen know thir complex
ethnicity, because they knew well their lineage
from noble-almanachs rather than peasants and
common people. Therefore their only prospect was
to follow the western type so called civic
nationalism which didn’t based on race. In the
late 1700s and early 1800s ,after and under the
aegis and appear of Panslavism the local slavic
nations developed their ethnic nationalism with
the invention of “slavic race”. It was true for
Romanians who dreamed that, their ancestors were
the great ancient romans instead of their shepherd
nomad ancestors. It was the main difference
between the Hungarian nationalism and the
nationalism of some minority groups
Storage,
Very interesting. Just hope we can keep Vandorlo and Bob and Common Sense off this discussion.
You interested about “Jewish Question” very frequently, perhaps you have Jewish
background from Sweden
storage at August 8, 2010 7:06 PM
—
Just to answer your implicit question – No, not to my knowledge, but I have met several Palestinians, both in Sweden, in Israel proper and on occupied territories (according to International Law) and heard their stories. This got me interested in the question of the creation of the Jewish State of Israel
Also being a certified Atheist, I see no added benefits to theocracies
.
It may have been that many Germans were responsibly for building many cities in Central Europe. Immigrant Germans and Vallons made a significant tribute to Sweden, like many Swedes built what is today S:t Petersburg
But what that makes the locals look like?
Well, I assume that is why Jobbik and similar organizations in Central Europe get some air at the moment – the revenge of the local underclass, ethnically held together by Ethnic Nationalism, like Israel
The Liberal Nationalism (Vote every day to be a citizen in this State) is of course more of my cup of tea. I can hardly claim to be a “Good Hungarian” based on ethnicity…
I am very disappointed in the 56 comments to my article. Except for couple of you, you are missing the point and are not addressing the subject, i.e., “ Perhaps-the-Time-for-a-Danubian-Federation-has-Come “. Many of you go all over the place without addressing it in a serious manner, the pros and cons of the idea. Some of you are brushing it aside in a cavalier manner that is a dream and cannot be done. I LIKE TO DREAM. Without a dream you a dead fish. It is an indisputable fact that the Kingdom of Poland and the Kingdom of Hungary were (and still could be) the balancing factors in Central Europe between Germany and Russia . With the slicing up of Poland and certainly the dismemberment of the Kingdom of Hungary not only the balance was destroyed but a huge vacuum was created to be exploited by either the state to the West or to the East. The dismemberment brought about internal animosity, economic disaster and in fact outright hate among the inhabitants of the region that still vividly exist today. If Trianon was the right thing, where are Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia now? Yes, it created 16 million ethnic minorities that did not exist before because those people were viewed as citizen, an integral part of the nation, and not minorities. The “Federation” from the Baltic to the Adriatic has historical precedence and when that existed the region flourished as a whole.
Continued…..
If we set aside the selfish ethnic extremism ( it does not mean the giving up of one’s ethnic heritage culture and language, etc.) of ruling one over the other then progress can be made in this area. Arbitrary actions, without citizens input
( plebiscite), by outsiders do not bring about lasting peace and tranquility. History and geography tie this region together, thus it is time for the countries in the area to develop a spirit of cooperation and bring into being a “Federation” for prosperity and peaceful co-existence to the benefit of all. What we have now, we can only look to decades of human rights violations, curtailment of freedom, economic turmoil and possible armed conflict.
History and geography tie this region together, thus it is time for the countries in the area to develop a spirit of cooperation and bring into being a “Federation” for prosperity and peaceful co-existence to the benefit of all. What we have now, we can only look to decades of human rights violations, curtailment of freedom, economic turmoil and possible armed conflict
Geza Cseri at August 9, 2010 4:15 AM
—-
How would a “Federation” guarantee “prosperity and peaceful co-existence to the benefit of all”?
That is a very strong statement and given the history of this region, which has been everything but peaceful and prosperous
Using the same logic, you could claim that the EU will do the same thing, and in a sense it has done that. No EU countries has gone to war with each other, but I assume you are not satisfied with that
Inside the Greater EU create more organized regions, that spans above the current borders of NationStates, is something I and a few others have been promoting. That I think is possible to realize in the nearest decades, but it will mean that the NationStates as an organization becomes less important
I see this as an organization around real or perceived ethnic/cultural lines, where the aim is to help its members to preserve their language and culture, but not based on geographic location
It will be a way of representing the ‘minorities’, but in that sense we all will belong to a ‘minority’ organization, what I would call the ‘Nation’
Geza – maybe if you examined issues from the point of view of Hungary’s neighbours, you might not be surprised why there has been so little interest in it. Have you/your organization had any dialogue with similar Polish, Slovak, Czech, Serbian & Romanian organizations in the US to see how they view things.
I’m not 100% sure, but publishing your suggestion on the day commemorating Trianon might not have been the best timing for you to put forth your suggestion.
@CG:
“You hit the nail on the head” – as we say in German …
Bloody crazy idea – a Danubian Federation, of course under the leadership of our glorious victator …
What do they think the EU is for ?
BTW: The Danunbe flows through Germany and Austria also – are we invited too ?
@Wolfi – You’re absolutely right. Seems strange that Geza doesn’t realize that many of the other countries prefer to work through, or within the EU framework, and don’t see the status quo as an impending disaster.
While Geza did not say it outright, there is also an implicit reference in his article that Hungary and Poland should be the “natural leaders” within the region. I think countries like Czech, Slovakia or Slovenia would question why any country less successful than them should be seen as taking a leadership role, especially when those countries are not handing out any money, or other external benefits.
Anyway, I’m not sure you are welcome in the federation, since one of its main purposes is to counterbalance Germany & Russia. In all honesty, I have never heard of one group trying to counterbalance another group (let alone 2 groups), especially when it is dependent on the other group for resources.
Geza Cseri,
Your mentality is out of date. We don’t need a counterweight to Germany as you suggest in a posting.
We are all part of the EU. This idea of a Danubian Federation is throw back to the pre WWI thinking. Strategic alliances … Blah Blah Blah ..
There is much stronger economic connection between Hungary and Germany than between Hungary and Poland.
Hungary is never going to be a Great Power, yet your writing is still in that nostalgic vein.
Let me add that the mentality of your Hungarian colleagues is woefully ignorant. One of your fellow colleagues at the Hungarain American organization sent me an email claiming that the “Slovaks and Hungarians had lived in peace for a thousand years …”
This is grotesque mythology.
The American Hungarian Federation is steeped in mythology about the Trianon Treaty and shows a mentality is simply not ready for the modern world.
Want to help Hungary? Push for reforms of both mentality and the system here. Stop promulgating mythology in the place of accurate history. Accept Hungary’s place as a small country in the EU. Embrace good governance, including a major crackdown on corruption and tax evasion.
The American Hungarian Federation is just an outlet for crying over spilt milk.
Hungarians still have a hard time understanding the concept of modern democracy – it isn’t winner take all concept.
Geza,
Under your glorious Austrian-Hungarian empire there was virtually no representation of Hungary’s minorities in the Hungarian parliament. And even after Trianon clipped Hungary’s wings, the Hungarians managed to turn into virulent anti-semites during the 1930s and even expelled their loyal German speaking citizens after WWII (Budaörs).
Hungary does not have moral authority to be a regional leader. That requires a clean record.
What is the Jewish representation in your American Hungarian organization? I bet it is a bunch of right wing Republican voting conservative Catholics who are still trying to figure out how a condom works …
Dear Geza Cseri,
as a Slovak, I can honestly tell you, there is absolutely no interest in the Danubian Federation of any sort in Slovakia. How can you persuade a nation, which sees Trianon as a blessing for its national emancipation, to give up its finally acquired souvereignity in favour of a project which is to revive its worse memories? Would you force it upon Slovakia?
Your worries over the conflicts are basically mitigated by the existence of EU – the truly supranational project design exactly to prevent what you fear – national conflicts and to counterbalance any excessive power of any European state (including non-member Russia).
The only reason for it seems to be the fulfilling of some old Hungarian sentiment for its 1000 years great kingdom, which is gone. For good, I hope.
American,
), is it really necessary to bring your point in this manner:
although I agree with your views in a lot of your posts (not all of them though
“What is the Jewish representation in your American Hungarian organization? I bet it is a bunch of right wing Republican voting conservative Catholics who are still trying to figure out how a condom works …”?
This approach makes even rationally viable argument unacceptable for any oponent…
The post above (Anonymous at August 9, 2010 4:33 PM) was mine. Sorry for missing signature.
“It is an indisputable fact that the Kingdom of Poland and the Kingdom of Hungary were (and still could be) the balancing factors in Central Europe..”
Balancing factor in CE was multi-ethnical Austro-Hungarian Empire in the late centuries, not Hungarian Kingdom. Or more precisely it was its ruling Austrian part.
Hungarian gentry has demonstrated its competence to rule its part of the Monarchy last time in 1868-1918 when Habsburgs granted them the right. Like a hunting dog cut off the chains, Hungarian nobility leaving a havoc in so called “non-hungarian” speaking communities in their part of the Monarchy. Despite of enacted laws which should have guaranteed the rights of ethnic minorities in the Monarchy. The laws which they somehow omitted in their endeavour to create one nation.
“If Trianon was the right thing, where are Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia now? Yes, it created 16 million ethnic minorities that did not exist before because those people were viewed as citizen, an integral part of the nation, and not minorities.”
The rhetoric of Hungarian nobility of 19th century with one Magyar nation and no ethnic minorities in the Kingdom. And with strange figure of L. Kossuth, paternal grandfather of the idea of Danubian Confederation, the great leader of Hungarian revolution of 1848 with Slovak ancestry. Chest-beating Magyar claiming there was not such thing as Slovak nation in the Kingdom of Hungary – yet not knowing a word in Hungarian in his childhood.
It was the president W. Wilson who had to admit the reality of crumbling Hungarian Kingdom and who refused the idea – or rather an “emergency plan”, which Hungarian aristocracy dusted off after 50 years, for Danubian Confederacy with the center in Budapest.
By that time, ethnic minorities didn’t even need an external intervention. They declared their independence from the Kingdom already in 1918. Czech and Romanian armies took their territories with their own forces. Romanian soldiers didn’t even stop until Budapest and left a true havoc in Hungary when they pulled back. Kingdom of Hungary politically and militarily collapsed 1,5 year before the treaty of Trianon was signed.
The idea of Danubian Federation is only Hungarian irredentism poping up from time to time. Like first in 1850, then after WWI and WWII. Deceptive idea designed to cure the “trauma” of one nation which is not even a trauma, but rather some chimera.
In the past, there was a country in Europe which was casting doubt on one treaty. The country was also promoting the purity of one nation. That country was called Germany and the treaty was called the Versaille treaty. We all know how it ended. Germany has learned well from the history. Hungary, however, has not.
It’s said that someone, who could not take his historical lesson, is oblidged to repeat it. Let’s hope it won’t be the case of Hungary. Hungary still has a time to learn from its mistakes.
@vdx , Only Czehs had higher ratio of
industrialization than Hungary. Romania was little
poor absloutly agricultural and backward (pop 6,5 M.
) Serbia was similar with 2,5 M population. Slovaks
were in situation, they didn’t join to the
czechoslovakian army. Perhabs they don’t want to
fight against Hungary.
After the Assassination in Sarajevo, the Hungarian
prime minister, István Tisza, and his cabinet
(sole in Europe) tried to avoid the breaking out
and escalating of a war in Europe, but his
diplomatic attempts remained unsuccessful.
Austria–Hungary drafted 9 million (fighting
forces: 7,8 million) soldiers in World War I (Over
4 million from the Kingdom of Hungary). In World
War I Austria–Hungary was fighting on the side of
Germany, Bulgaria and Turkey. The Central Powers
conquered Serbia. Romania declared war. The
Central Powers conquered Southern Romania and the
Romanian capital Bucharest. On November 1916
Emperor Franz Joseph died, the new monarch Charles
IV sympathized with the pacifists. With great
difficulty, the Central powers stopped and
repelled the attacks of the Russian Empire.
The Eastern front of the Allied (Entente) Powers
completely collapsed. The Austro-Hungarian Empire
then withdrew from all defeated countries. On the
Italian front, the Austro-Hungarian army could not
make more successful progress against Italy after
January 1918. Despite great Eastern successes,
Germany suffered complete defeat in the more
determinant Western front.
By 1918, the economic situation had deteriorated
(strikes in factories were organized by leftist
and pacifist movements), and uprisings in the army
had become commonplace. In the capital cities
(Vienna and Budapest), the Austrian and the
Hungarian leftist liberal movements (the maverick
parties) and their leader politicians supported
and strengthened the separatism of ethnic
minorities. Austria-Hungary signed general
armistice in Padua on 3 November 1918. In October
1918, the personal union with Austria was
dissolved.
The first Republic of Hungary
In 1918, as a political result of German defeat on
the Western front in World War I, the Austro-
Hungarian Monarchy collapsed. French troops landed
in Greece to rearm the defeated Romania, Serbia
and the newly formed Czech state. Despite the
general armistice agreement, the Balkanian French
army organized new campaigns against Hungary with
the help of Czech, Romanian, and Serbian
governments.
On October 31, 1918, the success of the Aster
Revolution in Budapest brought the left liberal
count Mihály Károlyi to power as Prime-Minister.
Roving soldiers assassinated István Tisza.[60]
Károlyi was a devotee of Entente from the
beginning of the World War. By a notion of Woodrow
Wilson’s pacifism, Károlyi ordered the full
disarmament of Hungarian Army. Hungary remained
without national defense in the darkest hour of
its history. On 5 November 1918 Serbian Army with
French involvement attacked Southern parts of the
country, on 8 November Czech Army invaded Northern
part of Hungary (present-day Slovakia), on 12
November Romanian Army started to attack the
Eastern (Transylvanian) parts of Hungary.
The First Republic was proclaimed on 16 November
1918 with Károlyi being named as president. The
Károlyi government pronounced illegal all armed
associations and proposals which wanted to defend
the integrity of the country. The Károlyi
government also dissolved the gendarme and police,
the lack of police force caused big problems in
the country. By February 1919 the government had
lost all popular support, having failed on
domestic and military fronts. On March 21, after
the Entente military representative demanded more
and more territorial concessions from Hungary,
Károlyi resigned. Károlyi (with a new
Czechoslovakian passport and Czechoslovak
diplomatic help) moved to Paris.
The Hungarian Soviet Republic
The polyethnic nature of Budapest in 1919. The
Heroes Square of Budapest was completely
demolished and rebuilt into Marx-Engels memorial
by the communists. The Communists wanted to
destroy all Hungarian historical monuments statues
and national symbols.[citation needed]
The Communist Party of Hungary, led by Béla Kun,
came to power and proclaimed the Hungarian Soviet
Republic. The Communists also promised equality
and social justice. The Communists – “The Reds” –
came to power largely thanks to being the only
group with an organized fighting force, and they
promised that Hungary would defend its territory
without conscription, possibly with the help of
the Soviet Red Army. The Red Army of Hungary was a
little voluntary army (53,000 men). Most soldiers
of the Red Army were armed factory workers from
Budapest.
In terms of domestic policy, the Communist
government nationalized industrial and commercial
enterprises, socialized housing, transport,
banking, medicine, cultural institutions, and all
landholdings of more than 400,000 square metres.
The support of the Communists proved to be short
lived in Budapest. The Soviet Red Army was never
able to aid the new Hungarian republic. Despite
the great military successes against
Czechoslovakian army, the communist leaders gave
back all recaptured lands. That attitude
demoralized the voluntary army. The Hungarian Red
Army was dissolved before it could successfully
complete its campaigns. The Communists had never
been popular in country towns and countryside.
In the aftermath of a coup attempt, the government
took a series of actions called the Red Terror,
murdering several hundred people (mostly
intellectuals), which alienated much of the
population. In the face of domestic backlash and
an advancing Romanian force, Béla Kun and most of
his comrades fled to Austria, while Budapest was
occupied on August 6. Kun and his followers
illegally took along numerous art treasures and
the gold stocks of the National Bank.[61] All
these events, and in particular the final military
defeat, led to a deep feeling of dislike among the
general population against the Soviet Union (which
had not kept its promise to offer military
assistance) and the Jews (since most members of
Kun’s government were Jewish[62]).
for slovaks and romanians
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