May 22nd, 2012

Poll puts Hungary second among countries worthy of being kicked out of NATO

We almost missed this, but last week Foreign Policy magazine published the results of a pre-NATO summit survey that included the above rather stinging indictment of Hungary. []

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  • Cogito

    Oh, this is just the usual, politically motivated despicable misinformation and disinformation. I must say, this kind of garbage is getting to be bloody tiring.

    The bombastic headline reads: “Poll puts Hungary second among countries worthy of being kicked out of NATO”
    First, the question was not which country was “worthy of being kicked out,” but: “If you had to kick one country out of NATO, which one would it be?”

    Second, the results of the poll are as follows:
    None: 22
    Greece: 18
    Hungary: 5
    Turkey: 4
    Iceland: 3

    What this means is that, out of the 57 ‘experts,’ IF THEY HAD TO kick one country out, 22 said NONE! In other words, even if they had to kick out a country, they would have kicked out NONE.

    Yes, there are two ways to lie: by telling a straight lie, and by statistics. You did both.

    • sheesh

      Headline is pretty straightforward to me. 22 people said they would not kick out any of the members, the rest named one country and among those Hungary was the second top choice. Mind you, the question and the choice of “none” are in clear contradiction because “have to” implies you’ve got to pick one. So if anything, the question is manipulative. It should’ve said: Would you kick out any of the members and if yes which one would it be? There’s nothing manipulative about the headline. It says what the poll says. It doesn’t say EVERYTHING but a headline CAN’T say everything. Still, if you have a better one, please share it with us.

  • Aloof

    I agree with you. The caption applies to Greece. So where are the captions that would be attributed to Hungary and the other countries? Should ask the Political Pest folks about that…

  • living_here

    Pretty lame interpretation of results. Yeah, Hungary is #2 but it’s pretty much noise between it and Turkey

  • Vidra

    I bet Greece is quaking in its boots with these results. Punish a country by chucking it out of an organisation that’s committed to spending money on American kit that will probably never be used and brings no financial benefit to most of its members. A punishment would be to get it to send more of its young people to be pointlessly killed or maimed in Afghanistan or Iraq.
    How come Orbán criticises the EU but not NATO? Is it because all those crisp uniforms and gleaming equipment gets him going, or does he have a little arrangement with the American arms industry? Maybe we should be told.

  • Aloof

    So what do you want? The US out of NATO? Every country in Europe to fend for itself? How do you think that would turn out for Europe?

    • Cicero

      It would turn out A LOT better – European nations would start becoming truly free, sovereign, and in control of their own destinies…

  • Honoring Hungarian History

    These results show the victory of Trianon over Hungary. Hungary used to be an important part of Hungary, a multi-ethnic power that engaged Europe- it had to, since it barely had a majority of ethnic Hungarians. After Trianon, it became almost exclusively ethnic Hungarian, and the magyars started turning inward, and had to blame everyone else for its problems. Now, Fidesz supporters have mastered the art of thinking that they are the victims, and the rest of Europe has noticed. Hungary is no longer a European country, and the rest of Europe is sick of it. Trianon was an attempt to neutralize and isolate Hungary, and Orban has succeeded in making that finally a reality.

    • Leto

      “Hungary is no longer a European country, and the rest of Europe is sick of it. Trianon was an attempt to neutralize and isolate Hungary, and Orban has succeeded in making that finally a reality.”

      I see some people here are trying to be funny as much as they can be:)

      • Cogito

        @ Leto

        To be funny one has to have at least some brains, otherwise they are plain stupid. 🙂

  • Vidra

    @Aloof, there is a UN peacekeeping force, and Hungary contributed to that long before it was accepted into NATO. There is usually an alternative solution.

    @HHH, Hungarian nationalism emerged in the early 19th century, and the jubilation over its dismemberment after Trianon was partly due to various Slav nationalisms and partly as a reaction to Magyar triumphalism after the Compromise of 1867. I don’t think the rest of Europe is sick of the Hungarian people, just of a government that sees its being out of step with the rest of Europe as a great leap forward instead of a colossal and costly mistake

  • Cicero

    This is a badge of honor, not a “stinging indictment”. NATO needs to be disbanded anyway; it has far outlived its original purpose and is now an actively harmful entity that executes meaningless wars of aggression against various nations on behalf of the U.S. Imperial Government, and threatens to bring on WWIII by creeping right up to the borders of Russia (in violation of every promise made by previous U.S. presidents from 1989 onwards…).

    And by the way – who the hell cares about some idiotic poll in Foreign Policy magazine? It’s a tool and mouthpiece of certain neocon circles inside the U.S. foreign policy establishment, that’s all!

  • olga

    With Greece, there were reasons given and wheater one agrees with the 18 votes or not, at least there was an explanation but with the other countries there were not and without reasons the vote is pretty meaningless.

    Could be they were miffed that Hungary left Europe without the proper 60 days’ notice ( see comment above: “Hungary is no longer a European country, and the rest of Europe is sick of it. ” )

    I also noted a reader’s comment on the Foreign Policy website pointing out that Cyrpus cannot be kicked out because it’s not a NATO member – I say kick them out anyway and let’s not worry about such irrelevant details.

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