June 25th, 2012

Israel withdraws invitation to Kövér as Hungarian Parliamentary speaker defends controversial right-wing author

Laszlo Kover at Hungary's "House of Terror" museum in April 2011

Knesset Speaker Reuven Rivlin has cancelled an invitation to Laszlo Kover, the Hungarian house speaker, to Israel for Kover’s attending a recent commemoration of Hungarian author Jozsef Nyiro in Romania, The Jerusalem Post reported on Sunday.

Kover was to attend celebrations of the 100th birth anniversary of Swedish diplomat Raoul Wallenberg, who saved thousands of Hungarian Jews during the Holocaust, in Israel in July.

According to the Israeli paper, Rivlin was appalled by Kover’s paying tribute to Nyiro, whose party had “cooperated with the German Nazi murderers in realizing their program to annihilate the Jewish People”.

“Anyone who participates in such an event cannot possibly then take part in an event to honor a man like Raoul Wallenberg, a beacon of humanity, who saved Jews, who is a symbol of the struggle against Nazi Germany and its collaborators, one of whom you chose to identify with and pay homage to,” the paper quoted Rivlin’s letter to Kover.

Kover’s cabinet chief told MTI late on Sunday that they have not yet received a letter from Israel’s Knesset. Laszlo Veress called it “strange” that the Knesset speaker should send messages to his Hungarian counterpart through the media.

Veress also said that Kover had indicated “through the customary diplomatic channels” a few days earlier that he could not fly to Israel due to different arrangements, and President Janos Ader would represent Hungary at the Wallenberg celebrations instead.

Kövér defends controversial author in letter to Wiesel

Meanwhile, Kover wrote a letter to Nobel Peace Prize-winning author Elie Wiesel arguing that Nyiro was neither a war criminal, a fascist nor an anti-Semite.

Kover wrote his letter in response to Wiesel’s returning the Grand Cross Order of Merit of the Republic of Hungary, which he had received in 2004, partly because of Kover’s attending a recent commemoration of Nyiro in Romania. Wiesel released the letter on Friday.

In his letter, Kover said that the Allied Control Commission in 1945 and 1947 cleared Nyiro of charges of fascism and anti-Semitism, and added that such ideas did not surface in Nyiro’s literature.

“Hungary’s communist propaganda maintained those charges for four decades and attempted to wipe Nyiro out of the public conscience,” Kover said.

“When passing judgement on creative minds, it is primarily their creation that should be considered, and double standards in that must not be applied,” the letter said. Nyiro’s merit lies in his literary life achievement, rather than in his “negligible but doubtlessly and tragically mistaken political activities”, Kover said in the letter.

Kover made a comparison with philosopher Gyorgy Lukacs, and said that he was appreciated for his scholarly achievement and not for his political activities during communist dictatorship in 1919 and after 1945. “While a street in Budapest was named after Lukacs, Nyiro is even denied a burial in his native land,” the letter said.

In his conclusion, Kover said that after “so many lies, so much forced silence and one-sidedness it may be time to consider our history as a whole” and wished “reconciliation for all of us”.

In a short note to the house speaker, Wiesel thanked Kover for his response, but stressed that he upheld a different opinion of Nyiro.

Wiesel added that Kover’s letter was lacking reflections to his remarks concerning what he saw as a renewed cult of Miklos Horthy, regent of Hungary in the interwar period.

The above photo of Kövér speaking at Hungary’s “House of Terror” museum in 2011 was published on the website of Fidelitas, the youth wing of the governing Fidesz-Christian Democratic party.

Visit www.hungarymatters.hu to receive Hungarian news agency MTI’s twice-daily newsletter.
Topics
Share
  • Paul

    “When passing judgement on creative minds, it is primarily their creation that should be considered, and double standards in that must not be applied,”

    You know as we did with Ákos Kertész.

  • Bowen

    “When passing judgement on creative minds, it is primarily their creation that should be considered, and double standards in that must not be applied.”

    I look forward to a retrospective of Hitler’s water-colour landscapes of Vienna in the National Gallery. Fidesz and Jobbik members can get a 25% discount.

  • mossad

    Hungary should think seriously about developing nuclear weapons. A good idea for Jobbik’s political program.

  • justasking

    Well, I personally am not a fan of Kover, his conduct, the way he disrespected Romania in order to fulfill one of Nyiro’s last requests; was inappropriate for the average citizen, unacceptable from a member of Parliament.

    I do however, agree with his response to Wiesel.

  • olga

    Re : the letter said. Nyiro’s merit lies in his literary life achievement, rather than in his “negligible but doubtlessly and tragically mistaken political activities”, Kover said in the letter.

    I really did not have an opinion about Nyiro’s literally merit and I thought perhaps the allegations of anti-S. were overblown but I just changed my mind.

    “tragically mistaken political activities” ? Doesn’t sound like a person whose writings I would want my kids to learn.

    I hope the Russians don’t find an author whose “tragically political activities” supported anti-Hungarian sentiments during the Communist years and introduce his his writings to kids because of his “literary achievement.”

    BTW, what exactly were Nyiro’s tragically mistaken political activities” ? that Kover referred to?

    • spectator

      There is a quite extensive Wiki-article in Hungarian, but here is a short version in English:

      Jozsef Nyiro was born in 1889 in Szekler Land, a Romanian region of Transylvania, which at the time was a part of Hungary. He was not only a simple “blood-and-soil” poet, but one of the leading cultural ideologues during the rule of Hungary’s national socialist Arrow Cross Party from October 1944 to March 1945, when tens of thousands of Jews were massacred or sent on death marches.
      Nyiro served in the Arrow Cross Party’s parliament, and he remained faithful to Ferenc Szalasi’s fascist regime up to the end of the World War Two. After 1945, he was hunted as a war criminal by both Hungary and Romania, but he was able to flee to Germany and then to Franco’s Spain in 1950. Today, his works are compulsory reading for Hungarian school children.

    • Leto. مؤدّب

      “Doesn’t sound like a person whose writings I would want my kids to learn. ”

      I’m afraid you’re very seriously mistaken then. Please try making an effort at learning about his literary achievements. You won’t find any trace of his political views in these.

      -http://hu.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nyir%C5%91_J%C3%B3zsef#Megjelent_m.C5.B1vei

  • get real

    I told you, the Magyars are stupid levitating in a
    revisionist atmosphere without to realize that those times are gone forever and the new conditions won’t allow the comeback of the dark episodes of the history on which they had a staring role!
    One by one ,the societies will reject them until nobody will
    take them seriously.

  • olga

    @ get real

    I am going to take the high road and not insult all Romanians because of you plus I also need to believe that you are a small minority, just like the JOBBIK crowd in Hungary. At the same time, I recognize that even a small segment of society can do a lot of harm to its targets and give his or her country a bad name, so congratulations for accomplishing this for your own country.

    Moving on – have you heard of the expression people in Glass houses should not throw stones?”

    I went to about 20 websites trying to get figure out what Nyiro was about and the websites included neo-Nazi to J*ewish websites.

    Take a look what I came up with about Romanians, yet despite the paragraph below, I do not believe that all Romanians are stupid nor do I think they represent your despicable views about Hungarians (I don’t even know if you are stupid but I could think of a dozen adjectives that are much worse and much more insulting.)

    (I cut some words from the original paragraph that made references to the picture that accompanied the article) :

    Radu Mazare, the popular mayor of the Romanian city Constanta, on a Nazi parade (with his 15 year old son) in the nearby costal resort town Mamaia during a fashion show “Mamaia Night” in July 2009.

    The Nazi’s beat is well tolerated, if not even admired, in today’s “free” Romania. May God guide Romania in getting rid of all its political clowns as the one the city of Constanta currently is having. That such a character can thrive in today’s Romania and be a leader of its Social Democratic Party (PSD) speaks volumes of the long road ahead that Romania has yet to travel to integrate into the charters and values of today’s European Union. “

    • keepin it real

      olga, you are no different from Leto. You have the same extremist anti-Romanian/ultra-nationalist attitude, and just as him you peddle ridiculous lies.

      Unlike Hungary, there is no Nazi revival in Romania. Radu Mazare is not the “leader” of the PSD, and he is no Nazi. He is indeed a buffoon. There was no “Nazi parade”, Mazare wore his outfit in a fashion parade where historical costumes were worn. Mazare likes to dress up. He’s dressed as a pirate, a Brazilian pimp, a Cuban revolutionary and a 1920s gangster. Clown yes, Nazi certainly not.

      Hungary has a very long way in matching Romania’s civilized and tolerant attitude towards minorities, and almost complete absence of far-right or far-left discourse in the political mainstream.

      • Leto. مؤدّب

        “Romania’s civilized and tolerant attitude towards minorities, and almost complete absence of far-right or far-left discourse in the political mainstream.”

        ROTFLMAO :D :D

        You’d better watch out for that cracking ceiling above you, szőröstalpú…

  • get real

    Olgica, do you think Hungary and the actual government is integrated in the European Union?

    How about to take on those jerks first an then on Romania!

    If you put on the same page a mental challenged mayor with the neo Nazi Hungarian government, you are out of your mind!

    When a neo Nazi,Parliament president, Kover bacsi, disrespect the Romanian government by coming to do political endorsements ,with a well known arrogance, don’t expect respect from the Romanians!

    One more time has being proved that you are not smart enough
    to take the best decisions! All the Kover bacsi fans lost the elections big time!

    If you want to be respected , you have to give respect but that’s not the case with the Huns!

  • olga

    @ get real

    Your anti-Hungarian postings were not simply directed at the government so let’s not kid ourselves.

    Thank God that every individual who now lives in former Eastern Block countries has the freedom to say the most vile things against political figures.

    However, that’s not what you are doing – you are painting all Hungarians with the same brush because (a) of past grievances real or imagined and (b) your disdain for Hungary’s political parties. Based on that combination, you endorse your government’s stance of making ethnic Hungarians’ lives a f..ing misery in Romania.

    I brought up that Mayor to show you that your own country has its own anti-Sem.lunatics so it’s good to know you don’t share those views as far as J*ewish people are concerned, however it’s pretty clear that whatever “hate” you have in your psyche, you saved 100% of it for ethnic Hungarians whose families “never moved to Romania.” and ought to have their culture and language respected.

    BTW, Yes, I do think Hungary integrated into the EU based on a bell curve report card.

    So today’s unasked for but no doubt truly appreciated advice: Get real, start apologizing for your disgusting comments to Hungarians not only in Hungary but all over the world who are not responsible for past or present political decisions and save all those insults for current politicians whose actions do not meet with your approval.

  • freedoms

    The Jewish murderers have yet to get a history lesson explained to them on the international level. I hope when a real Hungarian government comes to power one of it’s first and most important priorities is to support the freedom of the people of the world against Israel.

    The Jewish people have yet to learn their role in the murder of millions of people due to Communism, be that Ukrainians, over 700,000 Hungarians, or Lenin orchestrated mass murder of an estimated 1.5 in Volga region of Russian during war Communism in the early 1920s.

    Hungarians, Germans, and other peoples can not allow Jews to constantly blame people for a supposed Holocaust when they have no knowledge of their own racist, murderous, deceitful past. Under a real Hungarian government the first move should be to spend money to educate the world of the crimes committed by past Jewish elites and to spend millions in Israeli and European school institutions to teach younger generations the Jewish role in mass murders.

    • keepin it real

      Thank you for spelling out clearly what the likes of Leto, Olga and Justasking really think, beyond the BS. At least you’re honest

      • …justasking

        @real,

        ‘Thank you for spelling out clearly what the likes of Leto, Olga and Justasking really think’

        Pssst!

        I have no problem ‘spelling out’ my OWN opinions around here. So, if you please, keep your generalizations focused on other posters….kay’?

  • Igazi Magyar

    Here is some background on Nyrio from Hungarian Spectrum. There are many many great Hungarian writers, but I don’t think Nyiro is one of them. I hope Fidesz supporters realize that they are hurting the country by idolizing members of the Szalasi government:

    “What is the real point of contention when it comes to Nyirő? It is his politics. After the Second Vienna Award (1941) József Nyirő became a member of the Hungarian parliament and on the side he was the editor of a right-wing weekly called Magyar Erő (Hungarian Might). In 1944 he worked for another right-wing publication called Magyar Ünnep (Hungarian Holiday). What really marred his reputation was that after the Szálasi take-over he remained a member of parliament and became one of those who followed Szálasi in his flight to the west. His critics call him a fascist while his apologists try to minimize his political involvement. But even his admirers had to notice that Nyirő’s ideas showed a close relationship to the Nazis’ racism. His critics talk about his confusion between love and hatred, between Christianity and paganism. They claim that he is even more confused and harder to follow than Dezső Szabó who naturally had a great influence on him. But there was one difference between the two: Szabó fiercely opposed both German Nazism and its Hungarian variety, Szálasi’s Arrow Cross movement.

    “Not so Nyirő who even in exile kept in close contact with those members of Szálasi’s inner circle who were not sent back to Hungary by the Allies. He was close friends with Albert Wass as well as “the court poet” of Szálasi, Géza Alföldi. He was also a good friend of Lajos Marschalkó, who was condemned to death in absentia in Hungary. Marschalkó was the leading light of those on the extreme right who supported the ideas of Ferenc Szálasi. He was a fierce anti-Semite whose most famous (or infamous) book is Világhódítók: Az igazi háborús bűnösök (World conquerors: The real war criminals). It must have sold well. I have the third edition of it. Marschalkó received the József Nyirő Prize in 1954, a year after the death of Nyirő. Birds of a feather. It is hard to imagine that Nyirő was not an avowed Hungarian Nazi.”

    • justasking

      @Igazi,

      ‘It is his politics’

      So? What bearing does his political views have to do with his work, if it’s never trickled into it? That’s like saying…’I'm not going to read Shakespeare because he’s gay’…completely dismissing his talent because of his private life.
      ——-

      ‘It is hard to imagine that Nyirő was not an avowed Hungarian N*zi.”

      ‘the Allied Control Commission in 1945 and 1947 cleared Nyiro of charges of f*scism and anti-S*mitism’

      So, your saying that you know something this commission didn’t?

      • Pete H.

        1) This is not just about an author’s politics in general. It is about his particular brand of politics. A brand of politics that is considered outside of what is acceptable in a modern society.
        2) This has nothing to with individual citizens choices to read someone’s work.
        3) This is about the Hungarian state sponsoring the reburial and rehabilitating someone with unrepentant views that modern society finds repulsive – naziism and antisemitism.
        4) Someone’s politics and someone’s sexual orientation are not even remotely equivalent.

        • justasking

          @Pete H,

          ‘This is not just about an author’s politics in general. It is about his particular brand of politics. A brand of politics that is considered outside of what is acceptable in a modern society’

          If a person were to pick up and read one of Nyirő books, could/would the reader be able to gather what the author ‘particular brand of politics was’?

          Stop getting emotionally involved and use your head. Without a doubt, the man is controversial, but his work is not.
          ———–

          ‘This has nothing to with individual citizens choices to read someone’s work’

          Sure it does… you’re trying to force your opinions upon the ‘individual citizen’.

          I’d be curious if people who normally would not have read his work, ran out and bought his books to see what the fuss is all about?
          ——–

          ‘This is about the Hungarian state sponsoring the reburial and rehabilitating someone with unrepentant views that modern society finds repulsive – n*ziism and antis*mitism.

          What does this sentence mean to you?

          ‘the Allied Control Commission in 1945 and 1947 cleared Nyiro of charges of f*scism and anti-S*mitism, and added that such ideas did not surface in Nyiro’s literature’

          Now, given all that was going on at that time…how, ALL of Europe was ashamed by their lack of action, essentially ‘allowing’ what happened to take place…do you not think, this Commision, would have convicted anybody and everybody, who had even a whiff of f*scism and/or anti-s*mitism attached to them?

          From all the material that the Allied Control Commission would have had to pour over with a fine tooth-comb regarding this man, they concluded that he was NOT what he was being accused of.

          Exactly, which part of that is not enough for you?

          What right do you or anyone else has, to dismiss this conclusion, simply because it’s not the one YOU wanted to hear, in the process, continue to slander Nyirő name?

          People like you are dangerous…
          ———-

          ‘Someone’s politics and someone’s sexual orientation are not even remotely equivalent’

          Sure they are…both are private and NON of anybodies business.

          • Leto. مؤدّب

            “If a person were to pick up and read one of Nyirő books, could/would the reader be able to gather what the author ‘particular brand of politics was’?”

            Nope, not at all. But “somehow” these types just ignore this fact. They indulge in witch-hunting.

          • Pete H.

            Don’t have time to respond to all you nonsense but this does stick out.

            ” ‘Someone’s politics and someone’s sexual orientation are not even remotely equivalent’

            Sure they are…both are private and NON of anybodies business.”

            In 1941 József Nyirő became a member of the Hungarian parliament and on the side he was the editor of a right-wing weekly called Magyar Erő (Hungarian Might). In 1944 he worked for another right-wing publication called Magyar Ünnep (Hungarian Holiday). What really marred his reputation was that after the Szálasi take-over he remained a member of parliament and became one of those who followed Szálasi in his flight to the west.

            So how were his politics in any way private? Your lack of logical rigor is laugahbale.

          • …justasking

            @Pete,

            ‘So how were his politics in any way private?’

            You really are an airhead, ya know that?

            What side of the political pendulum a person swings towards, is NON of anybodies business. It’s a personal decision.

            Now focus, while I ask this again…what does his PERSONAL political views, have to do with his PROFESSIONAL writing, when one has NOTHING to do with the other and one is not reflected in the other???
            ———–

            ‘Your lack of logical rigor is laugahbale’

            This, from a Stalinist bigot? Oh, the irony!

  • wolfi

    This morning at breakfast in Munich my sister showed me the latest report on Hungary in their paper:

    -http://www.sueddeutsche.de/kultur/geschichtsrevisionismus-in-ungarn-angst-vor-einer-neuen-mode-1.1392381

    It seems the whole world realises what Fidesz is doing – but they won’t stop.

    PS: The Süddeutsche is one of Germany’s best papers and widely read …

  • olga

    @ keep it real

    Looks like “get real” is busy writing his letter of apology so you surfaced out of the blue.

    If you consider me a Hungarian nationalist, please add “J*ewish and Roma Nationalist” to the label although my Hungarian Nationalism is a bit stronger, just as J*ewish people and the Roma take their own racist attacks and unjust comments rather “personally” – Go figure. I promise to try and be equally offended regardless of the victims of abuse in question.

    Re: your Radu Mazare comments – are you kidding me?

    Please watch YouTube : “Radu Mazare, in costum de oftier nazist ” – I will trust you to tell me if you are still willing to defend his “costume” choice after watching it because I while I don’t speak Romanian, he is much more than a “buffoon” and btw ,strange how you consider me a Nationalist but you mitigate his behaviour because he happens to be Romanian.

    Off topic – I read that your own PM is now involved in some PhD scandaland I am sorry I don’t have time to read any details but I am sure you know what I am referring to.

    Totally irrelevant to our discussion but I know that dragging in red herrings is a popular pass time around here, so I thought I’d join the party.

    • keepin it real

      Olga, you may be Jewish and “Roma” (gypsy), but that doesn’t make you any better than the likes of Leto. You share the same hysterical hatred of Romanians and love of Hungarian ultra-nationalistic fantasies (which was obvious in your comments on the Trianon thread too). You also make up crazy allegations about Romania: that Romania makes the lives of Hungarians “misery” (when in fact the Hungarians in Romania are one of the most privileged minorities in Europe); that Nazism is on the rise in Romania (sources???) and that Radu Mazare is a Nazi (!!!), even though you admit you don’t speak Romanian so you have no idea what you’re talking about. Is Mazare also a Caribbean pirate and a 1920s American bootlegger? To compare Mazare’s buffoonery with the Hungarian government’s very serious glorification of Nazi war criminals like Wass and Nyro is simply dishonest.

  • get real

    Olgica,

    The first you have to do is to apologize for the misery and massacres your brave ‘honveds” did to the Romanians during the occupation!
    Second, a people who elect a neo nazi government doesn’t deserve respect, praising a nazi like Horthy and erecting statues of him!
    You are obsess with RM who is a buffoon and just tried to attract attention but I asure you, he is not an nazi.

    Did you hear about prince Harry wearing a nazi uniform? He is nazi also??

    you said:”you endorse your government’s stance of making ethnic Hungarians’ lives a f..ing misery in Romania.”

    Now ,this statement just confirm me that you are out of touch !

    Tell me in which country surrounding Hungary the Magyars
    were represented in the parliament more than the Magyars
    in Romania?
    I’m sure you went to Harghita and Covasna and you have noticed that your co nationals live very well, they can use their language in school, churches and everywhere,
    not to mention the hatred they show if you speak Romanians in those places!

    They just can’t get over it and understand that they are on Romanian Land and are a tolerated minority!
    Many of them are living much better than the relatives in Hungary!, right!?

    I repead over and over again: your arrogance just show how stupid you are and I can’t go further than Kover bacsi
    who came here , not on white horse like Horthy, but with a Yasomite Sam mustache for the “liberation” of the Magyars!
    The ridicule of the matter is that all the people he endorsed lost the election!

    On more thing, the biggest mistake the Romanian government did when they formulate the Constitution was that they have allowed the formation of political parties
    based on ethnic considerations!
    The result was that the former gov. did an association
    with the Magyars in the MRDSz and almost Nyiro bacsi, the nazi , who killed Romanians, was buried here!

    This is how the Maghyars here “are contributing” to the well being of the country!

    I hope with the reconsideration of the Constitution, there will be no more political ethnic parties because
    they are not focus to help the country, but for their self
    revisionist interest!

    Am i wrong?

    • seinean

      Da. Gresesti in multe privinte.

      • …justasking

        @seinean,

        How do you say …’You’re on crack’ and ‘Are you on crack?’ in Romanian?

      • Paul

        @ Seinean

        Don’t mind JA…she is just manipulating.

        • …justasking

          @Paul,

          ‘she is just manipulating’

          :D …. said the spider to the fly

  • justasking

    @Olga,

    I’m just throwing this out here, a vibe I’m getting…I don’t think ‘get real’ likes you.

    Just trying to give you a heads up….

  • judas

    the more interesting question is :

    Does Hungary need a school curriculum in which now
    Nyiro,Wass and the like are being taught. ????

    What should be achieved?

    • justasking

      @judas,

      ‘Does Hungary need a school curriculum in which now
      Nyiro,Wass and the like are being taught. ????’

      If you’re exposing Hungarian children, to great Hungarians writers (these men are clearly considered just that) yes, there is a need.
      ———–

      ‘What should be achieved?’

      The same that is ‘achieved’ when you expose children to other forms of art…an appreciation.

  • olga

    @ real and real:

    If your definition of a Hungarian Nationalist is someone who believes that Trianon was a travesty of justice and wishes that ethnic Hungarians in Romania would be considered a “distinct society” reflected in law along the lines of the French in Quebec, than you are correct in your assessment . ( I assume that when it comes to Trianon, you both consider President Wilson and Winston Churchill rabid Hungarian nationalists as well )

    I do not hate Romanians or any group of people, nor would I make an excuse for a Hungarian wearing a N*azi uniform and simply dismiss him as a clown or a buffoon because both words imply something foolish and harmless. I will dismiss that kind of behaviour as “foolish” the day the relatives of the 11 million H*olocaust victims do the same.

    I did not base my opinion regarding Mazare on the Romanian video which I did not understand, I mentioned it because it was visual including his child wearing a N*azi uniform. (nice touch) The incident was covered by North American papers I found on the Internet (my favourite sources) and no one viewed it the way the two of you did.

    I had no political opinions when I left Budapest as a child, so I view the ethnic Hungarian minority situation through Canadian eyes and that’s why I know that when a country, its gov’t and its people want to make an effort to give “special privileges” to a group with a “special history” it’s possible provided good will prevails. Perhaps I am judging you two unfairly but I missed the “good will” part in your postings.

    I am not sure what one of you meant by my “Hungarian ultra-nationalistic fantasies” but if it meant the Quebec type model in Romania, then you were correct.

  • olga

    @ JA

    re: “I’m just throwing this out here, a vibe I’m getting…I don’t think ‘get real’ likes you.”

    how can you say that? I thought real and real (can’t tell them apart, like Pete H and Paul) were just two well meaning Romanians who felt rather guilty about some old Treaty so they got on the defensive.

    I take my Hungarian Nationalist label seriously so I responded using the szekely-magyar rovasiras but it’s held up in moderation.

    • justasking

      @Olga,

      ‘I thought real and real…were just two well meaning Romanians’

      Yeah, maybe you’re right. Hey…do you really think, that real and real are for real? I mean really?
      ——–

      ‘so I responded using the szekely-magyar rovasiras but it’s held up in moderation’

      Shit! Why didn’t I think of that?!?

    • keepin it real

      You’re great at involuntary humor, Olga. What exactly should the Romanians feel “guilty” about? For liberating Hungary from Bolshevism and later from Nazism? For being generous, tolerant and civilized towards the Hungarian immigrant minority? For not kicking Hungarians out after 1944, like the Czechs rightfully did? For still tolerating the barbarism and extremism on the part of a sizeable proportion of Szekely immmigrants? Maybe you’re right. Too much tolerance and forgiveness on the part of the Romanians has been a bad idea, unfortunately. Forgiveness should have only come after official apologies from Hungary for 1848, for 1867-1918, for 1940-44 and for March 1990.

      • …justasking

        @real,

        ‘You’re great at involuntary humor’

        You obviously misunderstood her post…there is nothing ‘involuntary’ about it.
        ————-

        Being a product of ones environment, does not apply to you; I bet dollars to donuts, you’d be a lunatic in any language.

        • Paul

          I bet dollars to donuts, you’d be a lunatic in any language….and loose a lot of money.

          • …justasking

            @Tiny Tim,

            Good Morning my little racist Stalinist bigot!! Poking your nose in others conversation again?

  • olga

    @ one of the real brothers

    If you are not clear on what to feel guilty about, please read the President Wilson and Churchill comments I referred to in my posting yesterday that was released from \awaiting moderation\ detention.

    I am sorry, I don’t have the time nor the inclination to go down memory lane for all your grievances from 1848 up to 1944 but March 1990 sounds like a reasonable time .

    I already explained that I like to read North American media views because I am familiar with the publications not to mention I believe the distance from Europe would make the views more objective.

    I don’t want to give you the link to the New York Times article because links get held up and I already served my time so to speak, but here is the info that you can easily read on the Internet

    Upheaval in the East; The Romanian Revolution Over, It’s Back to Old Hatreds in Transylvania
    By CELESTINE BOHLEN, Special to The New York Times
    Published: March 21, 1990

    I shall not comment, you judge the information for yourself but I looked in my crystal ball and it told me the Hungarian apology will not be forthcoming.

    I also found a Canadian article but the writer’s name was Hungarian so I skipped the link to that one.

    • keepin it real

      Dear Olga, what about President Wilson? Transylvania was recognized as Romanian by Trianon precisely because of the Wilsonian principle of self-determination. So what exactly is your complaint? What should the Allies have done, declare war on Romania and Czechoslovakia to force Romanian and Slovak majorities to stay in Hungary? You must be truly insane if you think that would have been feasible.

      I don’t care what someone in an office in New York says, I was in Romania in 1990. There was indeed a lot of misguided reporting in the Western media, thanks to a doctored documentary by an Irish journalist on Hungary’s payroll, where a Romanian (Mihaila Cofariu) being savegely beaten by a Hungarian mob was presented as a Hungarian beaten by Romanians. Basically, some Western media simply turned reality on its head, and presented a pogrom by Hungarians against Romanians as a pogrom by Romanians and Hungarians.

      • keepin it real

        Here’s more details about the Irish documentary:
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_clashes_of_T%C3%A2rgu_Mure%C8%99
        The quality of Western media coverage of the riots is contested by many Romanians. An often-cited example is the gruesome footage of Mihăilă Cofariu mentioned above who was presented as a Hungarian being beaten by Romanians in the documentary ‘And the walls came tumbling down: Bad Neighbours’, directed by Peter Swain and produced by ethnic Hungarian Paul Neuberg.[4] According to its director, the filming crew arrived in Transylvania after the events and most footages, including the one of Mihăilă Cofariu, were provided by the Hungarian producer team, who let them believe that Cofariu was in fact a Hungarian being beaten by Romanians.[4] Also, during filming, the crew had no contact at all with any ethnic Romanian, all the documentation being gathered only from Hungarian sources, including some Hungarian contacts from the political scene.[4]

        And more details here (in Romanian, but there’s always Google translate):
        http://www.adevarul.ro/actualitate/eveniment/Operatiunea_-Cofariu_0_224977912.html

  • keepin it real

    And speaking of the “misery” that the Hungarian minority suffers in Romania, according to Olga:

    Targu Secuiesc, a Szekely village in Transylvania is organizing a neo-Nazi skinhead festival called Szekely Sziget, with the notorious neo-Nazi band Karpatia (banned in Slovakia) as headliners. The most outrageous thing about it is that it’s financed with public money from the city council and the county council, i.e. money from the handouts that they receive from Bucharest. So not only does the entire Szekely region live off handouts from Bucharest (since Szekelys are too pround to work), they also use some of that money to finance neo-Nazi music.

    • Leto. مؤدّب

      Let me translate from chauvinist Rumanian-speak:

      The Szekler town of Kézdivásárhely (-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T%C3%A2rgu_Secuiesc -http://hu.wikipedia.org/wiki/K%C3%A9zdiv%C3%A1s%C3%A1rhely ) is organizing a Hungarian festival with the participation of some far-right wing groups and persons. (It’s a bald lie to call them neo-Nazi.)

      The home page of the festival can be found here:
      -http://www.szekelysziget.hu/

      Some events are quite interesting: traditional archery, Hungarian scribe-teaching, artisans

      The baranta stuff is particularly interesting. That’s a Hungarian-(re)invented martial art.
      Watch this, very cool! :)

      -http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y69NLLyrULY

  • get real

    everything is coming alone!Stupid can’t succeed!

  • olga

    @ real and real

    Re: “what about President Wilson? ”

    Wilson: : The proposal to dismember Hungary is absurd

    Churchill : Ancient poets and theologians could not imagine such suffering, which Trianon brought to the innocent.

    Not for a second do I really think you should feel guilty about Trianon because you are not responsible for it. Plenty to feel guilty about the hatred you appear to have towards Hungarians which is the same MO the odious JOBBIK crowd adheres to. They ought not feel responsible for the distant past, only for the hateful garbage they spew probably since they learned to talk and repeat what their parents said.

    I don’t have any answers about what the Allies should have done about declaring war, but you already you know what I think about the present situation in Romania (clue: Quebec Model) Hope this still qualifies me for the insanity label, or did I have to come up with a war response for that honour?

    I do apologize for not finding a better article than the one in the New York Times and I admit I was negligent by not having the 1990 Hungarian payroll in front of me. However, I suspect there is no journalist in this world whose view you would have accepted if s/he showed Hungary in a favourable light.

    I copied two paragraphs written by you guys:

    1. You also make up crazy allegations about Romania: that Romania makes the lives of Hungarians “misery” (when in fact the Hungarians in Romania are one of the most privileged minorities in Europe);

    2. I tell you honestly that is no Romanian that likes Magyars because of the atrocities your relatives did to our nationals! Anyone who say that likes Magyars it’s a Liar!

    Would you mind clarifying how Romanians define the concept of being privileged ?

  • John Simpson

    I have just written a sponsorship proposal to Tesco for my planned ‘Hitler, Mussolini and Stalin in the Park, classical concert (no gypsies)festival series 2013!

    No answer yet!

  • get real

    Here it’s the definition:

    Despite the rudeness arrogance and disrespect of the Magyars tore the Romanian Gov. and the Romanian nation ,
    we tolerate these behaviors b/c we are treating them like
    Romanian citizens

    I guess this a big privilege( the tolerance) considering the feed back we get from them!

  • Big Fish

    Kover’s letter to Wiesel should include a request to see Weisel’s camp tattoo. Google “Weisel Tattoo”

    • Leto. مؤدّب

      This is a very interesting page:
      -http://www.eliewieseltattoo.com/the-evidence/photographic-evidence/buchenwald/

      I wonder what Mr. Wiesel and his lot have to say about these.

      • Pete H.

        You should be careful when you play your smear game. Carolyn Yeager, who runs that site is a self-proclaimed neonazi.

        From April through August 2007, Yeager was the Texas state leader of neo-Nazi American National Socialist Workers Party (ANSWP), a group that descended from the National Socialist Movement, the largest neo-Nazi group in the country. She also assumed the position of Assistant Editor at the ANSWP’s magazine, National Socialist, in July 2007. In a 2007 profile in National Socialist, she is quoted as praising AH, advocating the supremacy of the Aryan “race,” and claiming that the J*ws’ “long-term plan is to drive us off the land and alienate us from our roots so that we will not fight.”

        Don’t believe she loves AH. Here is her other website. Search the site with the name AH and you will find her celebrating his birthday. -http://carolynyeager.net/

        Very interesting indeed.

        • Leto. مؤدّب

          I see. So this explains those issues with the photos. Thanks.
          Very interesting indeed.

    • Curious George

      @Big Fish – I always knew you were a dickhead, but I never imagined it would be literal. -http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn22023-zoologger-the-fish-with-its-genitals-on-its-head.html

More content from Hungary's leading foreign-language media network
About Politics.hu | Become an All Hungary Member | Newsletters | Contact Us | Advertise With Us
All content © 2004-2013 The All Hungary Media Group. Articles, comments and other information on the All Hungary Media Group's network of sites are provided "as is" without guarantees, warranties, or representations of any kind, and the opinions and views expressed in such articles and columns are not necessarily those of the All Hungary Media Group.