January 5th, 2014

Roma MPs protest planned German occupation monument

Roma MPs of the opposition Socialists protested on Sunday the planned erection of a memorial in central Budapest to commemorate the 70th anniversary of the German occupation of Hungary.

The MPs expressed concern in a statement that the Fidesz-Christian Democrat government would “erect an altar to the occupying Nazi army” on the occasion of the Holocaust Memorial Year. They suggested that the government choose a location for a Roma culture and research centre, if it is indeed interested in honouring the memory of all Hungarian victims of the Holocaust.

A government resolution on the occupation memorial was published on the last day of 2013. The memorial is to be completed by the 70th anniversary of the start of the occupation of Hungary by German forces on March 19, 2014.

Electoral alliance E-PM and Hungarian Jewish organisation Mazsihisz have also protested the government decision to erect the monument.

The Government Information Centre said on Thursday that the government is paying tribute to all Hungarian victims with the erection of the monument commemorating the tragic German occupation and the memorial year to mark the 70th anniversary of the Holocaust.

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  • procastinator

    I know it is wiki , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Panzerfaust

    but lets just keep in mind one thing Hungary was occupied for 10 month out of a 6 year war , I love how no one here ever wants to talk about the other 5 year or 72% of WWII when Hungary was Germany’s best friends for life
    just saying

    • szebbjovot

      “72% of WWII when Hungary was Germany’s best friends for life ”

      Read about, Uneasy Alliance:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikl%C3%B3s_Horthy#Uneasy_alliance

      • wolfi
        • szgp

          You expect that he would spit in their faces? Behind the scenes he was doing everything possible to break with them. Looking at pictures is a simple minded approach to History. I’d like to find Goebbless diary in English. I’ve read some excerpts. Their you can read what the Nazis thought of Horthy his family and Hungary and why. When I have more time I’ll find it and I’m sure that you and others will continue to equate Horthy with the Nazis so I’ll get a chance to post it. It will also be good education for those who think that the German Nazis meant well for Hungary. Think lebensraum.

          • wolfi

            Horthy crawled into Mussolini’s behind already in the 20s and then switched allegiance to Hitler because he was stupid enough to believe that the Nazis would help Hungary.
            Of course Hitler wanted the whole of Eastern Europe as Lebensraum for his “Aryans” – to which group Hungarians surely didn’t belong.

            So if the Nazis had won the war Hungary would have been treated just like the other Balkan countries …
            PS: I know of course that Hungary is not a part of the Balkan geographically – but for the Nazis all the people to the East were “minderwertig” …
            Just read what “Hungarian” and “Adam” and “leto” write here about Slovaks, Romanians etc – and then you’ll see what German Nazis felt about Hungarians.
            PPS:
            My father saved a few Nazi books (Most, like Mein Kampf which my parents got as the standard wedding present from the government he burned – it would be worth a lot now …) – horrible stuff!

          • szgp

            Your mistaken to think that Horthy did not know what the Nazis intentions were. He felt the same way about nazis or the nyilas as he did about the communists. If anything he was an Aristocrat who had a powerful disdain for populist movements like the above. He considered the Nyilas as traitors just as he did the communists. The truth is that Hungary had just lost 3/4 of its territory and much of its industrial base, was in a very weak position with Germany on one side and Russia on the other. As the saying goes it was stuck between a rock and a hard place. He was looking to make peaceful changes to the Trianon treaty and Italy was one of the first countries to see that it might be in it’s interest to consider this. Then along came Hitler and threw the monkey wrench into the works. The war was never in Hungary’s interest but it could not just ignore it.

          • szgp

            I just realized that you helped me make my point about the pictures which you posted the link for. As you said the Nazis had disdain for the Hungarians, yet Hitler was smiling as Horthy was. Unlike yourself, politicians are able to hide their true feelings. Remember this: Horthy outlived the war and retired in the open to write his memoires with allied blessings. How many wartime German politicians managed that?

          • wolfi

            Why are you so fascinated by Horthy?
            He took Hungary into the war – on the wrong side – and then what happened?
            Yes, he survived (Stalin seems to have had a hand in it) but what about “his” people, how many Hungarians died and how did they live after 1945 – while he enjoyed the sun in Portugal …

          • szgp

            We are all survivors. He represents
            Hungary at a difficult time. He had many fans in America as well as England. He lost one son under suspicious circumstances on the Russian front. He nearly
            lost another when the Nazis beat him and took him to Dachau. He led Hungary through a difficult time honorably. I have repeated a thousand times that I do not think that he had a choice in picking sides. Poland had a treaty with the right side, how did that work out for them? Were they able to protect their people – Katyn or the Jews as Horthy did for a long time? The Poles actually received more help
            from Hungary at the start of the war than from England; we all know the help that they received from Russia. Polish and Russian Jews moved to Hungary for sanctuary – Khrushchev’s memoires. I don’t like misstatements in general.

          • wolfi

            Let me quote myself:
            Horthy crawled into Mussolini’s behind already in the 20s and then
            switched allegiance to Hitler because he was stupid enough to believe
            that the Nazis would help Hungary.
            That was the beginning of the end for the dreams of a return to “Greater Hungary” – anyway 15 million Hungarians and 15 million “stinking vlachs” (as the Nazis here are wont to say …) wouldn’t have worked in the 20th century.

          • szgp

            A baseless statement is a baseless statement no matter how many times you repeat it. I know that it is unshakable in your mind but the story of Adam and Eve is unshakable in some peoples minds, and is often repeated.

          • wolfi

            I’m not really interested in your idolatry of Horthy – if you want to know what the Neo-Nazis think of him (not too much …) you might read this, however it’s in German:
            http://dikigoros.150m.com/horthy.htm

          • szgp

            You do this all the time; you broach a subject and when I reply you call it pointless to discuss. The best that I could make out it is that the blog is accurate with some irrelevant nazi opinion thrown in, and many omissions. Single sentences describing an entire era usually do have many omissions. It’s not idolatry; interesting discussions could be had on some points with someone who is more familiar with the History and who took the opposing side. You and others make accusations based on very thin knowledge, if any. I could argue either side. I pick this one because based on my knowledge I believe it. I have to go, have a good night.

          • szebbjovot

            I got something similar. “Their you can read what the Nazis thought of Horthy his family and Hungary and why.”

            Excerpts from Veesenmayer’s report on Hungary, December 10, 1943:

            “Since 1526, Hungary has never been an independent country. …

            Even the Rakoczi revolution was not a genuine revolution, only a revolt. …

            Hungarians usually liked the risk-free, passive resistance…

            The so-called Hungarian nation has existed since 1918, but it proved to be unfit for
            national life, and this will not change in the future….

            Fear cannot substitute ideology…

            The Hungarian national anthem was written by a German from Cologne, Erkel…

            Their most famous poets were Slovaks…

            Gömbös also had German blood…

            Regent Horthy spoke only broken Hungarian until 1925…
            If he becomes agitated he still turns to German…

            According to a Budapest joke, an optimist learns English, a pessimist learns Russian…

            The biggest enemy is the 1.1 million Jews in Hungary…

            The regent is a soldier, he is unfit for politics. We have to make him the Fuhrer’s soldier indirectly, by ridding [Horthy] from his entourage…

            We should copy the British principle and the Hungarians should work, fight and spill blood instead of us [Germans]…

            The Hungarian soldiers will never turn their weapons against the Germans, even if they get such orders…

            [from the 3rd attachment]

            We should use the politics of carrots and sticks wit respect to Horthy.

            3. We should demand a new government in ultimatum, without giving detailed reasons.
            9. We can give a promise to spare his Hofjuden

            THe country should be divided into 5 districts. They will be led by bloodhounds, appointed by the Interior Minister. We already have the appropriate names.”

          • szgp

            In the English addition of Horthy’s Memoir’s the footnotes are written by someone not blindly sympathetic to him. The foot notes are a good source for a History of the thinking inside the Third Reich with respect to Horthy, Hungary and Horthy’s family. Along with Horthy’s memoirs they paint a good picture of why. Paramount is their annoyance with Hungary’s refusal to surrender the Jews, and Horthy’s attempts at surrender. I’ll look for the above.

      • wolfi

        From your favourite wiki:
        Hungary was now committed to the Axis agenda: on 24 February 1939, it joined the Anti-Comintern pact, and on 11 April withdrew from the League of Nations. American journalists began to refer to Hungary as “the jackal of Europe.”
        Yeah, Horthy was a jackal …

        • szebbjovot

          So?

          • MagyarViking

            Yes, PutinPutaleto’s neighbour, Dr. László Bárdossy de Bárdos (10 December 1890 – 10 January 1946), is of course a very good example to prove how Hungary was correct, then:
            “After resigning as prime minister, Bárdossy became chairman of the Fascist United Christian National League in 1943. After the German occupation of Hungary in 1944, Bárdossy and his followers collaborated with Prime Minister Döme Sztójay. Later on, they collaborated with Ferenc Szálasi’s Arrow Cross Party.”
            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A1szl%C3%B3_B%C3%A1rdossy#Biography

            Yes, Bárdossy just finished his life while serving The Right Hungarian Cause…

          • Hungarian

            Fuck you fake foreigner Jewish descent.
            Why is my country putting up with shit like you?

          • MagyarViking

            “Why is my country putting up with shit like you?”
            …because Magyar Strongmen like yourself betrayed the Magyar race by fleeing to Japan diluting the Magyar blood?
            At least I am brave enough living in the Lion’s dent diluting the Magyar blood…just for the fun of it…

          • wolfi

            Yes, Hungarian women are marvellous – at least some of them …
            I wonder how they can keep up with those psychopaths which call themselves “Hungarian men”, well obviously many of them can’t and are looking around for real men …

          • Romanian

            Old Russian soldiers and men who watch porno movies think they’re the best.

          • Hungarian

            Fleeing to Japan?
            Are you crazy?
            I am here to learn how to have a wonderful life in a homogenous society without your Jewish/Roma crap.

            Pay some respect to that fake foreigner!

          • Fu King

            This viking(?) character is the least of our problems. We have to put up with tons of shit from the lowlife “elite” in fidesz, mszp and whatever the bajnai gang calls itself these days.

      • procastinator

        That is fair enough but I was not talking about Horthy , I was just talking about which side the country was on for most of the war and to be honest they could have just done what Finland or Sweden did supporting but not really aligned , which you could call being smart or being a coward , but that depends all on the outcome , I just pointed out that from 1939 to 1944 Hungary was a willing partner

        • szebbjovot

          This was due to Vienna Awards, and hopes for regaining Southern Transylvania.

        • pantanifan

          I’m not sure that they did have the option of staying neutral, because geography also plays a role. When you’re squeezed between Hitler and Stalin, which side would you choose…?

    • szgp

      Poland was occupied for a lot longer and it had a treaty with the west. And the Poles, the Polish Jews in particular suffered proportionately as a result. As long as Hungary had control of its own territory there were no deportations. There are many allied references to this at the time. Hungary’s allegiance with Germany is a complex question. I suggest that the way allegiances take shape are based on strategic considerations and not on leaders making choices between good and evil influenced by the moral constitution of those they lead. The desire to survive is a big factor.

  • Unplanned Parenthood

    “protested on Sunday the planned erection”
    I protest the unplanned erections and the large number of unwashed kids of gypsies.

    • Orbán Győzike

      The British hate gypsies, not to mention the French and the Italian.
      There’s a reason for that, but it’s taboo, you can only identify gypsies when they are the “victims” of crime. When they are the criminals, they are protected by the plague of political correctness. We should just put them on covered wagons and send them back home to India already.
      Having a large number of gypsies in your country is a costly hobby and a thankless task.

      • Hungarian

        My thoughts exactly.
        Send them back to fucking India and we don’t have to borrow from IMF Jews to keep them happy on tobacco and palinka only to reproduce in the millions…

  • Romanian

    What is the point of this monument? First Hitler gave Hungary some free land, then Hungary supported him with the most cowardly and incompetent army in the history of the world, and so Hitler got mad. Oh well, at least the Soviets had some fun using the Hungarian “soldiers,” who did nothing but run around like headless chickens, for target practice.

    • szebbjovot

      “the most cowardly and incompetent army in the history of the world”

      You mean the Rumanian “army”? :D

      • szgp

        Yes but the officers knew how to apply lipstick and rouge to their faces.

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